General Skating Chat

[Paskud]

10 minutes ago, cirelle said:

Here's the thing tho, if they're saying the mechanics for lutz and flip are the same, they should also be one jump, not two. Rename the new jump! "Fake Lutz" would never fly but it's what they deserve.

"Flop" sounds better.🤭

[cirelle]

Just now, Paskud said:

"Flop" sounds better.🤭

 

 If only they had the self-awareness for it 

[liv]

2 hours ago, SparkleSalad said:

we know what's going on...

 

I"m so confused now I have no clue what's going on

[sallycinnamon]

56 minutes ago, vd_turnan said:

Honestly, it's like they changed everything according to Mishin's and RusFed desires - the combination of Flip and Lutz and the 'q' respectively. With the latter, they even admitted it was because last year RusFed was upset that for once the judges did their job and called Scherbakova's URs and wanted to avoid that happening again.

 

It's always USA vs Russia in this sport, now things happen how the latter wants it.

 

24 minutes ago, cirelle said:

Here's the thing tho, if they're saying the mechanics for lutz and flip are the same, they should also be one jump, not two. Rename the new jump! "Fake Lutz" would never fly but it's what they deserve.

 

Yeah. RIP Lutz (1913-2020).

[yuzuangel]

LOL, if they made the flip and the lutz one jump that would mess with SO many layouts. Cuz right now you're not allowed to repeat any triple / quad more than twice, but since flips and lutzes are two different jumps, you can technically only know how to do a 3Lz or 3F and do it four times in a program. Honestly, it's unfair to skaters who are missing an edge jump because those are much harder to fake (like Yuna Kim only had 6 triples bc she couldn't do the loop, but Sotnikova was able to 3 flutzes in a program).

 

If we made flips and lutzes the same jump, you wouldn't be able to do 7 triples in a program without a 3A anymore. Idk, honestly doing that might actually help make judging fairer, because almost no one has both the flip and the lutz, edges are very selectively called, and there's zero advantage to have a proper flip and lutz anyway...just ask Rika.  And if you're Yuzu and would never do a 4F because you know you can't do a correct one, then you're again at a disadvantage from others who...just don't care and do it anyway.

[vd_turnan]

1 hour ago, sallycinnamon said:

 

It's always USA vs Russia in this sport, now things happen how the latter wants it.

 

 

Yeah. RIP Lutz (1913-2020).

The USFED don't care what changes occur, they will find a way to benefit anyway. I'm waiting to see if they will call Vincent PRs and URs or just ignore the new rule.

[cirelle]

2 hours ago, yuzuangel said:

LOL, if they made the flip and the lutz one jump that would mess with SO many layouts. Cuz right now you're not allowed to repeat any triple / quad more than twice, but since flips and lutzes are two different jumps, you can technically only know how to do a 3Lz or 3F and do it four times in a program. Honestly, it's unfair to skaters who are missing an edge jump because those are much harder to fake (like Yuna Kim only had 6 triples bc she couldn't do the loop, but Sotnikova was able to 3 flutzes in a program).

 

If we made flips and lutzes the same jump, you wouldn't be able to do 7 triples in a program without a 3A anymore. Idk, honestly doing that might actually help make judging fairer, because almost no one has both the flip and the lutz, edges are very selectively called, and there's zero advantage to have a proper flip and lutz anyway...just ask Rika.  And if you're Yuzu and would never do a 4F because you know you can't do a correct one, then you're again at a disadvantage from others who...just don't care and do it anyway.

Yes, exactly! It would wreck havoc, which I’m here for, so they won’t do it. Not right now anyway. Next step will be to do away with ! and e after some more pressure from Rusfed, and violá!
 

Yuzu is like a ghost of an earlier time with his proper technique. Maybe it’s better to do it the other way, always specifying ppl’s true lutzes vs lutzes. They could have it as a bullet for goe for the lutz! 

[Paskud]

Not a surprise, but Dreams on Ice was officially cancelled.

https://onice.jp/

[SitTwizzle]

I don't know if it belongs to here... It is about "fans" and their "preferred" skaters' private life.

In Hey! Remember us? Songster01 said Javier Fernández had had problems with fans about a relationship?

I read too, that when Tessa Virtue and Scott Moir appeared not to be romantic partners, some "fans" were awful to them.

And, a skater recently, without giving name, said another skater had a contract with his sponsors, not to reveal any romantic relationship "because fans are jealous".

That some fans can have a pathological views of their "idol" doesn't surprise me, no more than the existence of "stalkers". (I must admit a crave for Yuzuru Hanyu's videos, how pathological is it?) but I would rather think it limited to a very few individuals.

Can it make a significant part of a skater's fanbase? Does it depend on who is the skater, of flags, of his skating in Men, Ladies, Pairs or Ice Dance...?

How can a fan of Tessa Virtue and Scott Moir be furious at their being engaged elsewhere? Why are they not happy for them instead?

How can a fan of a skater be less drawn to buy products he has commercials with, if this skater is in a relationship, than if he is completely alone? (And do fans really believe that a majority of adult skaters are "really completely alone" even if they don't publicise their relationship?)

Well this is not a psychology or sociology forum, but maybe some of you have read about this problems, maybe it has been more or less quantified, maybe there are medical explanations...

And if this post is inappropriate, or belongs to elsewhere, I see no problem to remove it, or please transfer it to the right thread.

[yuzuangel]

13 hours ago, cirelle said:

Yes, exactly! It would wreck havoc, which I’m here for, so they won’t do it. Not right now anyway. Next step will be to do away with ! and e after some more pressure from Rusfed, and violá!
 

Yuzu is like a ghost of an earlier time with his proper technique. Maybe it’s better to do it the other way, always specifying ppl’s true lutzes vs lutzes. They could have it as a bullet for goe for the lutz! 

Omg. A Lutz could be considered a "difficult entry"!! 

[Dreamer]

On 5/11/2020 at 7:23 AM, Fay said:

So we're back to a quarter underrotated jumps considered to be fully rotated? 

 

u know....certain feds pushed for that

 

[Sukigirl]

On 5/15/2020 at 1:29 AM, SparkleSalad said:

 

the full article

https://www.isu.org/figure-skating/news/news-fsk/13176-isu-updates-scale-of-values-and-judging-guidelines

 

 

I’m still catching up but dammit this makes me so so angry. Now they decide 4lo is the hardest? Where were all these pronouncements last season?
 

dammit.

[SparkleSalad]

24 minutes ago, Sukigirl said:

I’m still catching up but dammit this makes me so so angry. Now they decide 4lo is the hardest? Where were all these pronouncements last season?
 

dammit.

 

The hardest but apparently Yuzu has an advantage because of his body shape so it still doesn't deserve the most points.

[Sukigirl]

13 minutes ago, SparkleSalad said:

 

The hardest but apparently Yuzu has an advantage because of his body shape so it still doesn't deserve the most points.

 

I don't expect that ISU will reward loop accordingly. I'm surprised as it is that they've decided it's on par with Lutz/Flip, given there didn't seem to be much obvious pressure to change its value unlike RusFed & co's push on q and rotations for the benefit of its skaters. Or perhaps I'm not giving Jpn Fed credit? Cos the only skater of note that benefits from this is Yuzu (sorry Grassl!). 

 

What I'm mad about is that careers are finite. You lose a season or two and the chance to make your imprint with record scores and that's it. Bodies age, throw in a curve ball like Covid and the window of opportunity is gone. Like @memae said, Nathan's records under this scoring system are suspect with the devaluation of 4Lz and the acknowledgement that 4Lo is just as hard if not harder to achieve. What would the preceding two seasons have looked like with this change in values? 

 

[SparkleSalad]

Given how easy it is to manipulate GOE and PCS, I'd say they would have looked more or less the same.