General Yuzuru Chat

[KatjaThera]

52 minutes ago, Paskud said:

No, sorry. Yuzuru always was kuyashii monster. WTF does Evgenia have to do with this?!

Did I ever say otherwise? What I said - or meant to say, in case it didn't come out as such - is that she is also very intense and that intensity is something he can maybe be boosted by if he has bad days. And everyone has bad days. Whether he has bad enough days to need a boost or not, I don't know. Hopefully not. But if he ever does, having a skater who is a former World Champion and Olympic medalist, who knows what it's like to be on top, how hard it is to stay there and how painful when you can't maintain that level, but who also has a lot of intensity and focus and ambition and kuyashii, can maybe be of help. (I might also be biased, because while I love Jason and he's the greatest sweetheart ever, in my day to day life, people who appear to be as happy and positive as Jason often appears to be - I'm sure he isn't ALWAYS like that, but that's his image - drive me up the walls. So I might be projecting by thinking someone closer to Yuzu's own intense attitude might have a more positive potential effect on him, than someone more like Jason.) And just for the record, I am definitely not shipping Yuzu and Zhenya. I doubt they're even really friends, but as rink mates, I think they might be a good match - though one very damaging to Brian's hair.

 

30 minutes ago, eagle said:

Evgenia has said in an interview she trains together with Yuzuru & Jason 3X a week.

Jason has said(also in interviews) he has trained together with Yuzuru in group training. And after the training sessions Yuzuru will give comments to Jason abt jumps.

There are pics, snippets of Yuzuru skating round the rink at TCC. With the seniors and a few juniors(Conrad Orzel, Joseph Phan) there.

So, a lot of stuff is not speculation but what the other skaters have said abt Yuzuru when asked.

 

Thank you. I assumed they train together at times, but wasn't sure. Of course, even if they train together, that doesn't necessarily mean a lot of interactions, so we still don't know much in detail. But they're rink mates. I don't think it's that unlikely they influence or help each other (and we do know the helping does happen at times, like with Yuzu giving Jason tips).

 

3 minutes ago, Paskud said:

Of course they train sometimes together. That's not the problem. The problem is that whatever Zu does, first thing what people tend to assume is that it must be someone else recent influence. Because he can't be creative or motivated on his own.

Maybe Y-spiral indeed came from Jason. We don't know after all, right? But why first thing some people here assumed was "It must be Jason, not Yuzuru's own idea"?

Nobody said Yuzu can't be creative or motivated on his own. People wonder because some of these things are more typically Jason and with Jason at TCC and the timing as such, it's natural to wonder if it's a coincidence or not. Like you said, it might be, or it might not. I don't see why this is such a big deal, though? Even if he did pick it up from Jason, it doesn't mean Yuzu is not creative or can't get his own ideas. Even if the presence of this or other skater helps motivate him, it doesn't mean he can't be motivated on his own. It just makes things a bit easier for him. And at the end of the day, he could have the whole FS field training at TCC and it'd be worth nothing if he didn't actually make his own decisions and work hard. Which we all know he does.

 

I'm not even sure what we're arguing about anymore. It feels like every argument made is taken to the extreme, like we haven't had enough drama and now we need to argue amongst each other over nothing, since I doubt anyone here thinks Yuzu is not creative and can't get motivated on his own...

 

PS: at the Worlds SP Press Conference, Yuzu said he is inspired by the quality of Jason's skating, the richness of his expression and his flexibility. That might, of course, have been just nice words, but the timing can make one wonder. Is it really such a bad thing to wonder?

[vanadiezz]

1 minute ago, Paskud said:

I know. And I hope we will see them doing SBS Y-spirals in Sendai.

 

You know... Maybe he DID practice it lately for that reason since he rarely does things without plan.

 

When will we have Sendai broadcast? Cannot wait to see. 😊

[rockstaryuzu]

2 minutes ago, Paskud said:

I know. And I hope we will see them doing SBS Y-spirals in Sendai.

I'm thinking it'll be Ina Bauers. The Makuhari finale had Shizuka doing IB the full diagonal length of the rink past a line of skaters who were there for the express purpose of pointing to her doing it. Wouldn't be surprised if it's her and Yuzu  together at Sendai. 

[Paskud]

14 minutes ago, KatjaThera said:

Did I ever say otherwise? What I said - or meant to say, in case it didn't come out as such - is that she is also very intense and that intensity is something he can maybe be boosted by if he has bad days. And everyone has bad days. Whether he has bad enough days to need a boost or not, I don't know. Hopefully not. But if he ever does, having a skater who is a former World Champion and Olympic medalist, who knows what it's like to be on top, how hard it is to stay there and how painful when you can't maintain that level, but who also has a lot of intensity and focus and ambition and kuyashii, can maybe be of help. (I might also be biased, because while I love Jason and he's the greatest sweetheart ever, in my day to day life, people who appear to be as happy and positive as Jason often appears to be - I'm sure he isn't ALWAYS like that, but that's his image - drive me up the walls. So I might be projecting by thinking someone closer to Yuzu's own intense attitude might have a more positive potential effect on him, than someone more like Jason.) And just for the record, I am definitely not shipping Yuzu and Zhenya. I doubt they're even really friends, but as rink mates, I think they might be a good match - though one very damaging to Brian's hair.

 

You see? Here is problem.

Again the same. He had a lot of ups and downs in his career and know how to deal with them. He knows how to motivate himself.

[yuzuangel]

Hmm, I think Yuzu is very internally motivated for the most part -- but he obviously does have many influences so I think it's fine to speculate a bit,, but we won't know the truth unless he comes right out and says "so and so inspired me to do XYZ" (which he seems to be very open about and has talked about many times) so I think we should probably keep the extra speculation on top of that to a minimum IMO. 

 

Motivation to win though is one thing I DON'T see Yuzu needing to be "influenced" by anyone though, more likely than not Evgenia is influenced by him rather than the other way around 

[Neenah]

I think that we need to remember that the changes at TCC happened at the same time when a bigger change happened in Yuzuru's life and probably influenced him more than anything else, and that is the Olympics. Yuzuru was very focused on wining his second Olympics gold and everything he did in the last Olympic cycle was toward that goal. He worked tirelessly to perfect his elements and up his BV because that was what he needed and now that it is over he is free to experiment and try new things (or bring back old things). 

 

Maybe the other skaters have influence on him, it is natural when he (or anyone) interact with other people. But it is his willingness to experiment, learn and take risks that really matters here. Especially when he could have stuck to what he had before and it would have been enough.

[KatjaThera]

Again. I said, IF he ever needs it, her presence is more likely to help than Jason's. (Which is where the discussion started. Someone mentioned Jason's presence at TCC being good for Yuzu. I said more than Jason, I can imagine Evgenia's presence being good, in certain circumstances). IF. Key word is if. I'm not saying he'll crash and burn if there's no other skater to motivate him. I EXPLICITLY said he can motivate himself just fine. But, sometimes, a little help doesn't hurt. Even if he became completely demotivated one day, I'm sure he would pick himself up, by himself just fine. But if someone's presence - be it Evgenia, Jason, Pooh, Javi, or whoever else - would help, then maybe he'd do it a bit faster, a bit more easily. Or maybe not.

 

But seriously, stop putting words in my mouth and accusing me of believing Yuzu is incapable of handling himself - being creative or motivated - without others around. I do not believe that and I never said that.

[makebelieveup]

Can we move on from this debate please 

 

I am honestly more interested to know whether Masquerade or Crystal Memories will be his exhibition. I haven't been excited over an exhibition this much for a while, and I'm just laughing because I was a little disappointed at first when knowing it was POTO 2.0 LOL at least if he keeps Otonal and Origin next season, I can look forward to his ex.

[Ferrer]

3 minutes ago, makebelieveup said:

Can we move on from this debate please 

 

I am honestly more interested to know whether Masquerade or Crystal Memories will be his exhibition. I haven't been excited over an exhibition this much for a while, and I'm just laughing because I was a little disappointed at first when knowing it was POTO 2.0 LOL at least if he keeps Otonal and Origin next season, I can look forward to his ex.

 

Kind of a pointless debate to me without a real source from the person himself lol. Moving on, I wish he would pick Masquerade, but it's in Japanese so I'm not sure. Crystal Memory is more likely?

[makebelieveup]

3 minutes ago, Ferrer said:

 

Kind of a pointless debate to me without a real source from the person himself lol. Moving on, I wish he would pick Masquerade, but it's in Japanese so I'm not sure. Crystal Memory is more likely?

Masquerade has been performed twice so crossing my fingers. so many people like it over Crystal Memories too (although CM sweetheart you're gorgeous too) I will only accept Crystal Memories as an ex if Masquerade is the new short program  eventho I probably wont survive if it gets further finetuned

THEY NEED TO LEARN JAPANESE FOR HIM!

[Murieleirum]

1 hour ago, Paskud said:

You see? Here is problem.

Again the same. He had a lot of ups and downs in his career and know how to deal with them. He knows how to motivate himself.

 

One of Yuzuru's special traits is his humbleness. He will never think that he has nothing to learn from his training partners. Even if he has 1000 medals and they don't. 

 

Usually geniuses in history are also the best students, who learn from everyone, take the good that they see from other people and the outside world, and use it to become better artists, better people, better sportsmen and so on. I think some people here are too much on defense mode. Yuzuru is the first one who admits that he is influenced by everyone and watches his competitors' every move. So we know and he knows that he doesn't need other skaters to motivate him, but it will happen because he doesn't skate alone, he has a team and competition happens collectively, so other people will always influence you. I think it's a pretty objective statement. 

 

 

PS: I support Masquerade as new SP. Or a new Phantom SP in black and red. Yes please. 

[EisElle]

*pokes her head in* *wonders why there are arguments going on when there are Masquerade and Crystal memories to talk about*

Spoiler

 

Ok, can we all agree that Yuzu is his own person and has his own style? And of course that he is a competitive beast always looking to improve himself? 

But also, that he has his ups and down and people around can help him? (his family, the coaches, training mates, Kikuchi, Uchimura, who knows who else?) And that he isn't living in a void, on the contrary, he watches and absorbs everything around him? And that can also include other people, other skaters? And that without this ability of experiencing so intensely what surrounds him and all the various inputs he receives, he just wouldn't be this Yuzuru?

 

I don't think speaking about inspiration denies originality. Inspiration is like the building blocks, but how those will be put together will make the biggest difference. One can do many different things just starting from the same building blocks. One can put some building blocks aside for a while and then use them again, and one can also keep getting new building blocks from the most disparate sources, (after all, "experience" also means acquiring more data, new tools, learning more views).

Yuzuru being so open to learn and challenge provides him with a huge number of building blocks, but one of his amazing traits is that even if he were to use only a few building blocks all the time, he still wouldn't build terraced houses (is that how you say it?) but beautiful and highly customized villas (again is this how you say it? My english for architecture is sadly poor)😳 

And I think Yuzuru's ability to look around and being open to all kind of influences is beautiful and that it made him infinitely stronger than some people (and skaters) that feel content with just looking at their little garden🥰

 

now about Jason, or Evgenia , tbh I'm pretty sure Yuzuru would find more things to admire/learn for than I could think. Ngl, I would say that he hasn't much to learn from them, but that's probably not like he himself views things. Tho of course this is based on the idea I have of his personality, but really, he has found things to learn where I could see none and in the end that's why he is a great skater and, I think, a better person, too

 

 

lol @makebelieveup as I've told you already, are you me?

You posted while I was writing

 

Anyway as I said in the Faoi thread, I'd love for him to keep both as EX. Tbh idk how Masquerade could be adapted into SP (what's the duration to begin  with?), the focus on 2 more jumps + spin levels and stsq levels would IMO take away part of the rawness of the piece (and without glove the glove throwing would look like some Averbuck thing 👻). But I'd still like something darker (or upbeat) for SP and hey, he could use some of the elements (twirly twirly arms plz..low twizzles too plz still missing them). Tbh unless Yuzuru doesn't stop caring about making the lyrics understandable to most international audience, I can't see how he'll ever skate to Masquerade outside FaOI (Yuzu please we DON'T MIND and there's google anyway)...or, you know, he could go to nhk, be healthy and skate it at the gala for unbelievers to see the light😆 

From this pov I see more chances for CM (tho I can already hear the complaints about "always the same yadda yadda yadda"). It depends on the image he wants to project (judges seem to prefer a different style atm) and if he cares about that image at all (if he doesn't then he'll decides based only on what those programs mean to him)

 

But since we don't even know if he'll do more EX during FaOI, we're stuck in the "I wish" land. It's a beautiful land, let's enjoy while it lasts (before he decides he misses the yellow cape, after all 😜sorry Zu you know I love you and I kinda like Dory too, right?🥰 kinda, but I vastly prefer Masquerade and crystal fairy)

 

[makebelieveup]

15 minutes ago, Murieleirum said:

 

One of Yuzuru's special traits is his humbleness. He will never think that he has nothing to learn from his training partners. Even if he has 1000 medals and they don't. 

 

Usually geniuses in history are also the best students, who learn from everyone, take the good that they see from other people and the outside world, and use it to become better artists, better people, better sportsmen and so on. I think some people here are too much on defense mode. Yuzuru is the first one who admits that he is influenced by everyone and watches his competitors' every move. So we know and he knows that he doesn't need other skaters to motivate him, but it will happen because he doesn't skate alone, he has a team and competition happens collectively, so other people will always influence you. I think it's a pretty objective statement. 

 

 

PS: I support Masquerade as new SP. Or a new Phantom SP in black and red. Yes please. 

7 minutes ago, LadyLou said:

*pokes her head* *wonders why there are arguments going on when there are Masquerade and Crystal memories to talk about*

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Ok, can we all agree that Yuzu is his own person and has his own style? And of course that he is a competitive beast always looking to improve himself? 

But also, that he has his ups and down and people around can help him? (his family, the coaches, training mates, Kikuchi, Uchimura, who knows who else?) And that he isn't living in a void, on the contrary, he watches and absorbs everything around him? And that can also include other people, other skaters? And that without this ability of experiencing so intensely what surrounds him and all the various inputs he receives, he just wouldn't be this Yuzuru?

 

I don't think speaking about inspiration denies originality. Inspiration is like the building blocks, but how those will be put together will make the biggest difference. One can do many different things just starting from the same building blocks. One can put some building blocks aside for a while and then use them again, and one can also keep getting new building blocks from the most disparate sources, (after all, "experience" also means acquiring more data, new tools, learning more views).

Yuzuru being so open to learn and challenge provides him with a huge number of building blocks, but one of his amazing traits is that even if he were to use only a few building blocks all the time, he still wouldn't build terraced houses (is that how you say it?) but beautiful and highly customized villas (again is this how you say it? My english for architecture is sadly poor)😳 

And I think Yuzuru's ability to look around and being open to all kind of influences is beautiful and that it made him infinitely stronger than some people (and skaters) that feel content with just looking at their little garden🥰

 

now about Jason, or Evgenia , tbh I'm pretty sure Yuzuru would find more things to admire/learn for than I could think. Ngl, I would say that he hasn't much to learn from them, but that's probably not like he himself views things. Tho of course this is based on the idea I have of his personality, but really, he has found things to learn where I could see none and in the end that's why he is a great skater and, I think, a better person, too

 

 

lol @makebelieveup as I've told you already, are you me?

You posted while I was writing

 

Anyway as I said in the Faoi thread, I'd love for him to keep both as EX. Tbh idk how Masquerade could be adapted into SP (what's the duration to begin  with?), the focus on 2 more jumps + spin levels and stsq levels would IMO take away part of the rawness of the piece (and without glove the glove throwing would look like some Averbuck thing 👻). But I'd still like something darker (or upbeat) for SP and hey, he could use some of the elements (twirly twirly arms plz..low twizzles too plz still missing them). Tbh unless Yuzuru doesn't stop caring about making the lyrics understandable to most international audience, I can't see how he'll ever skate to Masquerade outside FaOI (Yuzu please we DON'T MIND and there's google anyway)...or, you know, he could go to nhk, be healthy and skate it at the gala for unbelievers to see the light😆 

From this pov I see more chances for CM (tho I can already hear the complaints about "always the same yadda yadda yadda"). It depends on the image he wants to project (judges seem to prefer a different style atm) and if he cares about that image at all (if he doesn't then he'll decides based only on what those programs mean to him)

 

But since we don't even know if he'll do more EX during FaOI, we're stuck in the "I wish" land. It's a beautiful land, let's enjoy while it lasts (before he decides he misses the yellow cape, after all 😜sorry Zu you know I love you and I kinda like Dory too, right?🥰 kinda, but I vastly prefer Masquerade and crystal fairy)

 

You are the better me though 

 

That's true and I think the program is very energy consuming already. but I trust that Yuzu can still make it work because he is Yuzuru Hanyu after all, although I understand that means he would have to run at full speed. But man this rock Phantom is soooo addictive. also  *whispers* Jeff is behind the choreo 

[rockstaryuzu]

31 minutes ago, Ferrer said:

 

Kind of a pointless debate to me without a real source from the person himself lol. Moving on, I wish he would pick Masquerade, but it's in Japanese so I'm not sure. Crystal Memory is more likely?

....again, someone mentions a song having Japanese lyrics as somehow making it unsuitable for competition. Why? I ask this out of honest curiosity. There have been many skaters in the past who have used pieces with non-English lyrics for their competitions (every piece ever skated to opera comes to mind), WTH would it make a difference if the lyrics were Japanese? 

 

He just skated a whole season with HYK , which is sung in Japanese, as his EX and no one complained, so What. The. Duck? 

 

The only things holding Yuzu back from using Masquerade are: 1. Whether he can make it into a competition-ready program, and 2. Whether he can get the performance rights to use it. 

 

#2, is, in my opinion, the real obstacle. Remember the lengths he had to go to in order for Joe Hisashi to agree to let him use H&L? And remember how Kevin Reynolds had to scrap his programs mid-season last year because Hisashi wouldn't grant him rights? That's where the trouble lies. not 'because the song's in Japanese'. 

 

Just how prejudiced do you think the rest of the world is? Ayoyoi!

 

Anyway, the way Toshi is gushing like a newly-minted fanboy over Yuzu, I would not be surprised if he gives Yuzu carte blanche to use any song he likes, for anything he likes. 

 

 

[Murieleirum]

4 minutes ago, rockstaryuzu said:

....again, someone mentions a song having Japanese lyrics as somehow making it unsuitable for competition. Why? I ask this out of honest curiosity. There have been many skaters in the past who have used pieces with non-English lyrics for their competitions (every piece ever skated to opera comes to mind), WTH would it make a difference if the lyrics were Japanese? 

 

He just skated a whole season with HYK , which is sung in Japanese, as his EX and no one complained, so What. The. Duck? 

 

For me personally it's the fact that there are vocals, and the pop-ish feel to it that's kind of an issue, I would feel the same (and I do actually) about other languages and other pop songs. I guess I kinda like Masquerade as a song, but I wouldn't listen to it without Yuzu skating (I think Crystal Memories is a lil bit too dramatic. I forgive it only because Yuzuru likes it and I watch him skating anyways). Between the two, I would say Masquerade could be used as a program song without any problems. I'd rather a more classic, lyrics-free version of the Phantom tho. I'm a classicist, lol, I always prefer the classical music version of anything.