shanshani Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 12 minutes ago, sallycinnamon said: List of judges who successfully made their judge exam at Nebelhorn Trophy and who're on the list of International and ISU judges list now (plus one int. judge who got deleted from it) here. I'm not sure I understand. Some of these judges have definitely judged internationally previously. For instance, Laurie Johnson (USA) has an extensive judging record from last season which shows very strong evidence of national bias. Did she get removed at some point and re-instated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sallycinnamon Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 10 minutes ago, shanshani said: I'm not sure I understand. Some of these judges have definitely judged internationally previously. For instance, Laurie Johnson (USA) has an extensive judging record from last season which shows very strong evidence of national bias. Did she get removed at some point and re-instated? It seems Laurie Johnson was only international judge so far, now she has become ISU judge http://www.rinkresults.com/judge?judge_id=1721 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanshani Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 1 hour ago, sallycinnamon said: It seems Laurie Johnson was only international judge so far, now she has become ISU judge http://www.rinkresults.com/judge?judge_id=1721 so she was promoted? ...well that's great, she provably favors American skaters, on a level similar to how Russian judges favor Russian skaters. ugh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sallycinnamon Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 6 minutes ago, shanshani said: so she was promoted? ...well that's great, she provably favors American skaters, on a level similar to how Russian judges favor Russian skaters. ugh Yes, she was - and it won't be surprising if she also favors her own skaters if we see her at big ISU championships this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanshani Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 29 minutes ago, sallycinnamon said: Yes, she was - and it won't be surprising if she also favors her own skaters if we see her at big ISU championships this season. I ran a t-test on her judging record for US skaters v other skaters and got back p < 0.01, so...yeah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liv Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 On 10/2/2019 at 4:26 PM, shanshani said: Figure skating just isn't that popular in America any more, I guess. A lot of the country doesn't have a tradition of ice sports, and they haven't had a ladies star in forever (which is why they gotta push Alysa Liu so hard, I guess). And I feel like American gender norms prevent men's from getting that popular even when they have Nathan, and it doesn't help that a lot of the population is still kind of racist towards Asians and Asian Americans. Figure skating isn't that popular in the US anymore, but I think it has more to do with that country not having a top female skater for so many years. I think figure skating popularity in the US has always rested heavily on the female figure skaters. They beyond adored Michelle Kwan...she still walks on water, even after all these years and any tour she was on was pretty much sold out. I think after she left is when the down turn began...there was no one like her anymore, with big charisma, always gave a performance, and was usually tough under pressure... people turned away from the sport and now it's been so long that it's no longer something people pay attention to. Alysa Liu... well, if she continues to improve then that might go a way towards bringing back some of the public. I think we'll continue to see a definite push for her from judges... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airi Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 I just wanted to say... there's 48 entries in ladies category at CS in Warsaw O.O is it some kind of record? http://www.isuresults.com/events/fsevent03111935.htm I was even considering going there if some interesting skaters come, and maaany interesting skaters will be there, but I can't even imagine how are they going to fit all four disciplines there. I mean... 48 ladies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Cat Lady Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 7 hours ago, airi said: I was even considering going there if some interesting skaters come, and maaany interesting skaters will be there, but I can't even imagine how are they going to fit all four disciplines there. I mean... 48 ladies... That's pretty incredible. Is there no guideline for entries? There's such a big difference between challenger events. I find this to be one of the weakest, least interesting challengers even with so many entries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanshani Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 18 hours ago, airi said: I just wanted to say... there's 48 entries in ladies category at CS in Warsaw O.O is it some kind of record? http://www.isuresults.com/events/fsevent03111935.htm I was even considering going there if some interesting skaters come, and maaany interesting skaters will be there, but I can't even imagine how are they going to fit all four disciplines there. I mean... 48 ladies... ugh...so much data entry that I'll have to do to incorporate this competition into my data set. but on the other hand, lots of data. hmmm I'm almost done writing up my judge bias review. The last thing I have to do is switch around judges' nationalities in order to show that bias isn't due to "cultural familiarity/preference" because judges from culturally similar countries don't overscore each others' skaters. Which, for the vast majority of judges is true. But then you see one or two judges (and a couple more than that from former USSR countries *cough* *cough*) who hit statistical significance and then some, and you begin to wonder about those people. We always suspected bloc judging from former USSR countries, and it looks like the data bear that out for at least some judges, but while most anglophone judges don't overscore other anglophone countries' skaters, we also have Richard Dalley, USA ice dance judge, sitting at p = 0.002 for how he scores Canadian IDers versus others. Suspicious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanshani Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 ehh, screw it, let's publish. comprehensive review of judging bias here would welcome comments before I try to disseminate this more widely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sallycinnamon Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Judges draw for Europeans, 4CC, Junior Worlds and World Championships 2020: https://www.isu.org/docman-documents-links/isu-files/documents-communications/isu-communications/22396-isu-communication-2288/file No Japanese judge at Men or Ladies event at Worlds, only in Ice Dance. Judges draw at Men is very Western oriented. USA has judges in all four disciplines. Ladies at Worlds will have more judges from Eastern countries (or Central European) that other disciplines, especially compared to the Men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanshani Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 15 minutes ago, sallycinnamon said: Judges draw for Europeans, 4CC, Junior Worlds and World Championships 2020: https://www.isu.org/docman-documents-links/isu-files/documents-communications/isu-communications/22396-isu-communication-2288/file No Japanese judge at Men or Ladies event at Worlds, only in Ice Dance. Judges draw at Men is very Western oriented. USA has judges in all four disciplines. Ladies at Worlds will have more judges from Eastern countries (or Central European) that other disciplines, especially compared to the Men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paskud Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Tbh, at last WC we had judges mostly from small-mid feds and look what happened, so I don't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuzuangel Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 8 hours ago, sallycinnamon said: Judges draw for Europeans, 4CC, Junior Worlds and World Championships 2020: https://www.isu.org/docman-documents-links/isu-files/documents-communications/isu-communications/22396-isu-communication-2288/file No Japanese judge at Men or Ladies event at Worlds, only in Ice Dance. Judges draw at Men is very Western oriented. USA has judges in all four disciplines. Ladies at Worlds will have more judges from Eastern countries (or Central European) that other disciplines, especially compared to the Men. What a random draw!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercedes Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, yuzuangel said: What a random draw!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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