General Skating Chat

[Katt]

The main problem is always the bias judging.  They want to calm down the quad race by reducing BV, but if they still giving GOE, PCS, edge/UR calls inconsistency, the system would broken again, sooner or later. When we still see a -2 or even positive GOE for a fall, or a 0 and +3 stand next to each other for the same jump, its the judge's fault, not any quad or skaters.  To change the GOE factor to -5 +5 would give judges more power to inflate the score. We would rarely see a +4/+5 goe given to a perfect jumps in the first 2 years of new judging system,  but when its come to Oly season, suddenly some of the skaters find new miracle techniques and max GOE everywhere. Then, another chance to change the system come again  And tbh the scoring for ladies are wild too, idk why they only target men. Its not like ladies are more artistic than men 

 

About the artistic/ athletic programs, I dont want to talk about this anymore, because its dumb. On the hindsight, they said that it may happen after Beijing 2022. At that time, Yuzuru definitely already retired, so I just and enjoy the drama. 

[SSS]

6 hours ago, Eclair said:

I think so, too. But Japan is a big sponsor, so they don't really mind them having a medal contender in the future. And they know, if they propose something that will not be beneficial to what the Japanese federation want, they won't get their approval. So the value for 4flip and 3 flip stays almost the same. They're picking on the skater with the weakest federation and that is Boyang ...

Axels are super low, loops are super low, lutzs are super low...Flips almost stay the same...I hate what ISU and JSF imply...

[meoima]

Now I wouldn't be against individual medals for elements, they should have jump competition in which skaters perform solo jumps from single rotation to quad for like 10 times in a row and the guy who gets the highest average score will get the gold.

- Gold for the best lutz technique 

- Gold for the best axel

and so on... gold for the best sit spin, best layback spin... lol

i wouldn't mind. They will have to make a lot of medals though.

[Xen]

2 minutes ago, meoima said:

Now I wouldn't be against individual medals for elements, they should have jump competition in which skaters perform solo jumps from single rotation to quad for like 10 times in a row and the guy who gets the highest average score will get the gold.

- Gold for the best lutz technique 

- Gold for the best axel

and so on... gold for the best sit spin, best layback spin... lol

i wouldn't mind. They will have to make a lot of medals though.

That might be a good idea, as would elevating the small medals a bit to a formal ceremony etc. But I would just imagine the huge line of TV channels willing to broadcast that....

[Pamigena]

3 minutes ago, meoima said:

They will have to make a lot of medals though.

 

I'm sure the French federation still has a couple of cardboard coasters lying around somewhere

[Forcefield]

4 minutes ago, meoima said:

Now I wouldn't be against individual medals for elements, they should have jump competition in which skaters perform solo jumps from single rotation to quad for like 10 times in a row and the guy who gets the highest average score will get the gold.

- Gold for the best lutz technique 

- Gold for the best axel

and so on... gold for the best sit spin, best layback spin... lol

i wouldn't mind. They will have to make a lot of medals though.

 

Considering how the GPF medals were just flimsy paper I think they have that covered if they wanted. 

And then I forgot which event, but the medals were the sizes of coins though so. Resources aplenty everywhere it seems. 

[meoima]

Just now, Pamigena said:

 

I'm sure the French federation still has a couple of cardboard coasters lying around somewhere

I am sure my ice rink still has plenty of METAL medals to share the burden. Lmao

[yuzuangel]

8 minutes ago, Forcefield said:

 

Considering how the GPF medals were just flimsy paper I think they have that covered if they wanted. 

And then I forgot which event, but the medals were the sizes of coins though so. Resources aplenty everywhere it seems. 

Honestly medals aren't expensive lmao

 

This already looks better than those plastic sunburnt orange medals at GPF and the teeny tiny junior worlds medals and "small" (literally) worlds medals.

[sweetwater]

I don’t like the idea of replacing current SP and FS with two new programs to evaluate a skater’s technical skills and artistry separately.

Firstly, as some people have already said in earlier posts, you need to have technical skills to express something artistically, especially when you express it with your body. If you are going to present something like Yoko Ono’s Grapefruit or John Cage’s 4’33’’, all you need is your ideas, but that is not what ISU is expecting, I suppose.

Secondly, it’s not technique vs. artistry, it’s jumps vs. other technical skills. Why always mislead people into believing that technique and artistry are two different things, and jumps have nothing to do with artistry? A jump with difficult entry/exit that perfectly fits the music is not artistic? To land a jump very softly to let the audience appreciate the soft sound of a flute is just athletic?

Thirdly, if figure skating has lost its audience in some countries, it is not because that figure skating has become too jump oriented, but because that figure skating has become less accessible in such countries for some reason.

As a whole, the ISU official’s comments quoted in the article sound self-deceptive.

 

I think stuff like JGP streaming with Ted would contribute more in increasing popularity and accessibility of the sport in the long run…

[axelnojutsu]

16 minutes ago, sweetwater said:

I think stuff like JGP streaming with Ted would contribute more in increasing popularity and accessibility of the sport in the long run…

There's a thought, #ted4president2k17

[Xen]

2 minutes ago, axelnojutsu said:

There's a thought, #ted4president2k17

Well at least for the single's and pairs disciplines....that would work wonders....

[katonice]

Someone kindly worked out the proposed percentage changes in BVs for each jump

 

[axelnojutsu]

I still can't figure out who's supposed to be benefitting from all this

[yuzuangel]

2 minutes ago, katonice said:

Someone kindly worked out the proposed percentage changes in BVs for each jump

 

 

Why does it look like all of Yuzu's favorite jumps (or ones he will add) will be affected the most 

[SSS]

3 hours ago, Xen said:

60% seems a tad high. I think it's a bit odd to give percentiles to how scores should be weighed actually, and you can increase the PCS percentile by lowering the TES scores (which lowering BVs gets you, but then gets defeated by an increased GOE range). What I would find more interesting if they factor it.  For example, if you skate a clean program, should you get a small bump in the PCS scores on the merit of that? Should we get a small downgrade in PCS depend on the number of falls? There was also talk in another forum about fixing the backloading by using a progressive system, such as just 5% for the first 30 s of the back portion of a program, and progressively getting to 10% extra to distribute the backloading a bit more evenly. Can this be applied to PCS? For example, if you have a totally squeaky clean program, should we have a multiplier of 10%? That way in those extremely rare cases, a clean program can garner a score above 100- so the precentile of points from PCS does increase. The tricky part is how to deduct for falls and unclea programs- I would suggest maybe going down a full 10% if the skater has more than 3 falls, but only progressively moving to that. Anything in between, keep the PCS score as is without factoring. It would serve to point skaters towards consistency more than going too far one way or the other. 

 

But I don't think this above method is what the ISU is looking for....

Progressive back loading score sounds really cool. I doubt it will be considered because I question their math their logic and everything...

 

 

We might need a different set of judges to judge pcs...PCS should be separated from TES.

Clean or not should not inflate PCS...It is already included in goe and some category in PCS. PCS should be a set value not bind to TES, if not 100 then 120, depends on the average TES of all current skaters. It needs to be the same for all skaters...