General Skating Chat

[katonice]

The problem is, there is no accountability at all it seems. I know they do some sort of score review after the competition, but do they actually talk about anything useful during these sessions? 

[CupidsBow]

1 minute ago, AsteroidB-612 said:

You know hate is such a strong word and I don't know who you are referring to when you said that some of us are on a hate train but personally, I did not hate Shoma, and actually quite enjoyed his performances of LOCO at 4cc and world's last season. But the judging he received as of late really is making me see him in unfavable light more and more...

 

It's easy to say not to blame the skater if it's the judging that's the problem, but can you fault another skater's fan for not being warm towards Shoma after they see this unfair treatment? If you look at how hard the uncles and Yuzu before him (and Deniss now) had to work for several seasons and competition to raise those PCS and GOE scores, isn't it only natural that fans of these skaters become resentful and salty when we see that the judges are throwing candies at a performance even shoma himself knew wasn't up to par(he said in the interview after that he missed some steps after jumps and the choreography didn't feel internalized yet )? 

 

If ISU is trying to raise popularity by flaming fan war with unfair judging, I think it will succeed this season if they keep on doing this kind of inflation for Shoma and Nathan.

 

If it applies to you, you know. If it doesn't, it doesn't. I'm not attacking anyone, I just obviously am not 'seeing him in an unfavourable light' as much as some on here are. I didn't say that as a provocation, I said it as a fact. I do not dislike Shoma the way some of you do.

You don't have to be Shoma's fan or anything, I'm not particularly warm on Nathan for pm the same reason (tho Shoma doesn't quite run his mouth the way Nathan did a bit last season) but I like to think I'm not leaping at the chance to talk shit about him. I rather keep an open mind he'll try to improve his weak points to earn the gifts judges give him. which he likely is, as is Shoma. Boyang doesn't quite get the candies Shoma and Nathan do, but he's working on his weak spots too. 

I mean, taking his comments afterwards into account and how he took the scores i think he knows it's inflated and a bit ???? 

You might notice that I'm agreeing that his PCS was too high and his 4F needed lower GOE but whatever I guess.

 

lol fanwars do not raise popularity. It gets attention, sure, but it doesn't exactly coax new fans to join the fold, you know? And it won't get more money rolling in.

[robin]

13 minutes ago, meoima said:

I was interpreting one ISU seminar in which the ISU specialist said this: "You'd better to keep the gap in between 0.25 to 0.5. Gap like 1 or above is too big in factoring." 

Judges will not give you 7 in SS but 9 in IN because it's against what they were trained... They have to make the number events. That's why the game of PCS is dangerous. Once you get above 90 PCS, you will not get lower than that for most of the time. Judges give out scores based on tier. Not on actual skills. For example someone can do 60 crossovers and still get above 90 PCS because judges count them in as medal contenders.

 

This almost sounds like ISU's original intentions re. COP were to set up a system that would burn itself down within a few olympic cycles. 

[Anony]

2 hours ago, Xen said:

..Ugh, don't get me started, I watched a couple more of the videos of the SP since I had work during the live stream. Deniss's SP presentation wise, was the only one I think I actually liked, and the last spin was interesting (that sit pancake position is not easy to maintain). It had speed, elegance,  and a certain lightness that some of the other men lacked (maybe it's his long legs). The rest I felt like I was forced to like, cause logically I should not dislike it....

Deniss deserved better everything 

[xeyra]

14 minutes ago, katonice said:

The problem is, there is no accountability at all it seems. I know they do some sort of score review after the competition, but do they actually talk about anything useful during these sessions? 

 

Supposedly getting rid of anonymous judging should have helped curb some things but I'm not sure it did anything other than make it more transparent to the informed skating fan the political tint of certain scorings. LOL at the examples given by the skating protocol instagram on Ice Dance. 

[AsteroidB-612]

3 minutes ago, CupidsBow said:

ou might notice that I'm agreeing that his PCS was too high and his 4F needed lower GOE but whatever I guess.

Yeah I see that, and this is the reason why I even wanted to reply to you on this subject, because I can see that you are trying to be objective. But I am just expressing my personal frustration (can't speak for any else) concerning the situation of Shoma and Nathan here and not hating on them( unless seeing him in unfavable light is already counted as hate? ).

 

So I kind of wish that you would not just use the word "hate train" to talk about fans here who may have voiced their concern or frustration with shoma as scores and jump technique and whatnot goes. Noone likes to be labeled, especially when we can't possible know who is being labeled.

 

[Anony]

Kim-Asada media created rivalry was terrible tbh. And if that's what ISU going for, they need to stop. It didn't really benefit anyone in the end, really the only "special" thing you get is hate comments from the other fans on their videos and it's f*cking ridiculous.

 

I've been wanting to stay out of things like this so god f*cking help me.

 

But yes it is frustrating to see skaters you don't like all that much get higher scores they may/may not deserve, but it really isn't their fault. Hell, I haven't ranted here or on any of my SNS, but I'm salty af when it comes to Shoma's PCS and GOEsand Nathan's and Jason's too tbh, also Zagitova's. But their fed or coach's influence or whatever doesn't reflect to them... mostly. So until we see a skater get outed for bribing the judges or something, rly all they did was skate and try their hardest. This isn't directed at anyone, or even the current situation, but since the debate is coming out now, pls just keep it in mind, last part is for everyone and in any general situation.

 

That aside sh*t all over the judges and ISU all you want,  they deserve it tbh

[CupidsBow]

21 minutes ago, AsteroidB-612 said:

Yeah I see that, and this is the reason why I even wanted to reply to you on this subject, because I can see that you are trying to be objective. But I am just expressing my personal frustration (can't speak for any else) concerning the situation of Shoma and Nathan here and not hating on them( unless seeing him in unfavable light is already counted as hate? ).

 

So I kind of wish that you would not just use the word "hate train" to talk about fans here who may have voiced their concern or frustration with shoma as scores and jump technique and whatnot goes. Noone likes to be labeled, especially when we can't possible know who is being labeled.

 

 

Read the forum rules I guess if you want to get a grasp on what is hate. I think anyone who knows it applies to them just doesn't really care but I do think you're geting a bit too worked up over a very small throw away comment. If you take it that personally maybe manage yourself to make sure that doesn't apply to you? I wasn't even referring to the discussion going on now since it's, for the most part, sticking to the responsibility of fair scoring being down to the judges. Shoma might benefit from it but I doubt he's pleased to get a new PB (even by 0.1 points) on a performance he knows was not the best he could deliver and wasn't better than the SP he performed at Worlds after a whole season of refining the program. I wouldn't be, at least. He got 45.70 PCS for Worlds and Lombardia, and that's ridiculous.

 

 

and PCS scoring by teir needs to end god this makes me more mad about that article. Make a radical change to PCS scoring, morons

[kaeryth]

3 minutes ago, Anony said:

Kim-Asada media created rivalry was terrible tbh. And if that's what ISU going for, they need to stop. It didn't really benefit anyone in the end, really the only "special" thing you get is hate comments from the other fans on their videos and it's f*cking ridiculous.

 

I've been wanting to stay out of things like this so god f*cking help me.

 

But yes it is frustrating to see skaters you don't like all that much get higher scores they may/may not deserve, but it really isn't their fault. Hell, I haven't ranted here or on any of my SNS, but I'm salty af when it comes to Shoma's PCS and GOEsand Nathan's and Jason's too tbh, also Zagitova's. But their fed or coach's influence or whatever doesn't reflect to them... mostly. So until we see a skater get outed for bribing the judges or something, rly all they did was skate and try their hardest. This isn't directed at anyone, or even the current situation, but since the debate is coming out now, pls just keep it in mind, last part is for everyone and in any general situation.

 

That aside sh*t all over the judges and ISU all you want,  they deserve it tbh

 

I do get a feeling that creating a 'rivalry' angle is something media really really likes (looking especially at you JPN media) because it's 'good' tv. But the thing is, you don't need all this in sports. This is sports not a telenovela or a tv drama. They could get away with it a long time ago with Plushenko and Yagudin because those 2 actually hated each other (I remember NBC did a super dramatic pre olympic fluff piece about this) and I think they feel they need 'drama' for FS to sell (Tonya Harding anyone?).  Meanwhile USFS is really selling this underdog narrative thing they're going for with the whole "Miracles Do Happen" tagline. /sigh/

[Anony]

33 minutes ago, kaeryth said:

 

I do get a feeling that creating a 'rivalry' angle is something media really really likes (looking especially at you JPN media) because it's 'good' tv. But the thing is, you don't need all this in sports. This is sports not a telenovela or a tv drama. They could get away with it a long time ago with Plushenko and Yagudin because those 2 actually hated each other (I remember NBC did a super dramatic pre olympic fluff piece about this) and I think they feel they need 'drama' for FS to sell (Tonya Harding anyone?).  Meanwhile USFS is really selling this underdog narrative thing they're going for with the whole "Miracles Do Happen" tagline. /sigh/

When will media learn that people like friendly rivalry just as much smh  like why do you think everyone was all over Javier and Yuzuru's friendship. Heck, why does anyone think Yuzuru has such a huge fanbase?? He might be the best skater in the world and bringing in the results, but there's a difference between rooting for a skater and a skater's skating. People are head over heels with him, Yuzuru Hanyu, the person, not bc of his skating, but bc he's a good person and people want to see good people suceed.

[xeyra]

12 minutes ago, kaeryth said:

 

I do get a feeling that creating a 'rivalry' angle is something media really really likes (looking especially at you JPN media) because it's 'good' tv. But the thing is, you don't need all this in sports. This is sports not a telenovela or a tv drama. They could get away with it a long time ago with Plushenko and Yagudin because those 2 actually hated each other (I remember NBC did a super dramatic pre olympic fluff piece about this) and I think they feel they need 'drama' for FS to sell (Tonya Harding anyone?).  Meanwhile USFS is really selling this underdog narrative thing they're going for with the whole "Miracles Do Happen" tagline. /sigh/

 

Wait, since when is USA the underdog in anything? 

[kaeryth]

2 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

Wait, since when is USA the underdog in anything? 

 

Well, in the 1980 Winter Olympic games an inexperienced US hockey team won against the more experienced Soviets. They dubbed this event “Miracle on Ice” and after that they've been very much milking any underdog Americans winning by a 'miracle' narrative since because it always captivates the American public. But I don't think that narrative works for American FS this season because Nathan is certainly a medal contender as well as the Shibutanis.

[CupidsBow]

The USA seems to have an attitude of 'WE ARE THE BEST but why does everyone hate us  ' and thus the underdog narrative begins. 

[Forcefield]

20 minutes ago, CupidsBow said:

The USA seems to have an attitude of 'WE ARE THE BEST but why does everyone hate us  ' and thus the underdog narrative begins. 

 

I am American and I think this is true and I also hate it.

 

And, we hold grudges. Anything relevant or not gets thrown into the mix.

[SparkleSalad]

59 minutes ago, kaeryth said:

 

I do get a feeling that creating a 'rivalry' angle is something media really really likes (looking especially at you JPN media) because it's 'good' tv. 

 

Such a nasty, bitter rivalry.

 

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