Team USA

[micaelis]

A postscript to my earlier post about Ilia and Autumn Classic.  I overlooked this in earlier viewings of his free program but finally it registered and in order to make certain I was not hallucinating I ran this particular element several times using YouTube's .25 speed.  Yes, my eyes had not deceived me.  There it was, not very elegant and so probably early in development, but here he was in a jump doing a single rotation.  What's so great about a single rotation?  Not much if you are talking about skating jumps as they are usually done.   But here it was, a single rotation, made extraordinary because in this jump Ilia's body was HORIZONTAL.  Has any other skater done the same thing?  I highly doubt it, but Ilya doing it makes sense to me because there have been moves he's made, not just in jumping, which have a certain 'gymnastics' aura to them.  This is what makes me view Ilia's future development as something very much to be watched.  The kid is very much able to think outside the box and one wonders what wonders he might produce in coming years.

[micaelis]

Just a short note regarding Ilia's horizontal jumping.  He calls it a raspberry twizzle.   He does it again in the Japan Open from last weekend.  It's still not fully developed but he's made it a bit cleaner.  The thing is he's going into territory not seen before in figure skating by making at least elementary jumps horizontally part of his technical vocabulary.  This bares watching.

[micaelis]

OK, here it is.  I wanted to wait until Skate America was over before posting again about the new and (very much) improved Ilia Malinin.  He's worked closely with Shae-Lyn and the results are plain to see.  He took the Autumn Classic by 44 points, and took Skate America by 30 points, collecting a SP score over 100, a free skate program over 200 and total score over 300.  But those numbers really don't tell the whole story.  The program qualities do the job.  His short program is impressive but his free skate is so densely packed with detail you might think yourself watching Yuzu turned blond.  There's hardly a second when Ilia is not involved with doing something.  And he packed four quads into the mix, but what really strikes me is watching the details in the non-jumping part.  There's such a wealth to see and some of it is new to the sport.  Ilia's evidently looking at gymnasts and divers and seeing what they do and thinking if possible of adapting them to action on the ice.  Such is, for instance, his raspberry twist (I erroneously called it a twizzle in an earlier post). I was wondering where the 'raspberry' came from and evidently 'malinin' means 'raspberry' in Russian, a single-rotation jump done where the body is horizontal.  There are other quasi-jumps and such done during the choreographic sequence and along the way even when not doing one of the elements called for by the rules.  All of this prompted the commentator to say Ilia was from another planet (where have we heard that before but in connection with Yuzu) and also 'a superstar in the making'.

 

Which brings me to my main point and that is to distinguish between a superstar and a legend.  Yuzu became a superstar in the 2013-2014 season, taking gold at the GPF, Olympics and Worlds.  He was the dominant skater then and basically ruled the roost in the years following to the year of his retirement.  Even despite the fact that Nathan was the one taking the gold during those last years of Yuzu's competitive career, Yuzu was still the reference point.  It was Yuzu, not Nathan, who could fill all the seats in an arena and the ice show promoters knew it and acted accordingly.  Yuzu after retirement brought in Yuzu the professional and it can be said that the year following his retirement saw a massive statement about what an ice show could be, turning it from an entertainment into an experience.  What we've seen with Yuzu as he moved through his competition years was Yuzu building the foundations of Yuzu the legend, a legend which consisted of awesome skates, awesome audience response (those Poohvalanches or Poohbursts) which brought a new dimension to the notion of audience involvement in figure skating competitions.  And then there was Yuzu off the ice, Yuzu in Toronto basically living at TCC or at home.  No night life for him.  He was too involved with critiquing his skating and getting through his classes at Waseda University, where he ultimately earned a degree in cognitive science.  And back home in Japan, when he was there, we also saw him in all his efforts toward reconstruction after the earthquake, an event in which he had very personal and life-altering memories.  All of this made Yuzu in Japan a living icon, one of the most popular and respected individuals in that nation.  But there is also Yuzu's international fan-following, a phenomenon which those on this forum know well since they are a major part of it.  When we look at all of this we can easily see that Yuzu has already become a living legend.  And he will remain so.  Others may come along who also become legendary, but once a legend, always a legend.  What is a legend?  A legend is a person who is a cultural or historical reference point.  And that is exactly what Yuzu is.  A reference point and as a skater the Greatest of All Time.

 

Now we get to Ilia.  Ilia, to begin with, is young, very young although he entered senior level competing at a later age than Yuzu did.  Ilia's first season was that saw him medal at every event taking gold in all except the GPF and Worlds (bronzes there).  I don't know skating history in any great detail but is there any other skater in their rooky year at senior level who medaled in everything.  If there is please point him out.  Then there is the quad-axel, the Holy Grail of jumps.  Yuzu did all he could to make it happen and failed making the podium in Beijing in pursuit of it.  In Ilia's initial competition in the 22/23 season did it and proceeded to do it several times more to prove it wasn't a fluke.  On the strength of his full palette of jumps he coasted through the season but he had a lot of criticism about the quality of his skating.  His PC scores were lamentable.  In more than one interview he readily admitted so but indicated he would be putting major effort towards correcting that situation.  In his first competition of this season he showed he was quite serious about that and his PC scores, while not of Yuzu level were nevertheless quite respectable.  He took the competition by better than 40 points.  Then down in Texas this weekend at Skate America, competition he won last year (the youngest ever) he showed that the Canadian experience was not an outlier.  His margin in Texas was more than 30 points.  As a skater he's the genuine article.

 

I would think it very likely Ilia will be the poster-child of this Olympic cycle.  He IS a superstar in the making but what really makes a superstar goes far beyond the mastery of one's sport.  It needs charisma, something which Yuzu has in abundance and which Ilia also does.  It's different from Yuzu.  Ilia's not Japanese.  He's an American teenager whose great passion when not on the ice is skateboarding.  That is somebody people can readily identify with.  Also Ilia doesn't have an earthquake in his biography.  That gave Yuzu a major motive when pursuing his skating career.  He was proving to himself and to others that there is life after the quake.  Ilia's charisma is there, though, the sign being that there were a number of plush animals raining on the ice after Ilia's free skate performance.  Nothing on the scale of the avalanches of Poohs after Yuzu skated.  But it's early going.  The thing is that Ilia is quite good looking and that makes it easier to becoming a superstar.  But what really tells the tale is the smile on Ilia's face after a successful performance.  His smile is absolutely radiant, one of the best I've ever seen.  Interviews are another matter.  Ilia is not made for interviews.  He will come out with some pious platitudes but it is evident he doesn't have the depth of vision Yuzu has (again, no earthquake).  Yuzu has stared death in the face and has had to deal with the reality of thousands of deaths where he could have been one of them.  Eastern Virginia (Ilia's home turf) is not noted for earthquakes but if, for instance, an F5 tornado had torn through his home town and killed dozens and his home was spared while people just two blocks away had theirs blown apart and possibly their lives also, we might be seeing some sensitivity in Ilia's awareness.

 

In summary on Ilia, I think, unless a major meltdown occurs, that we are entering the Age of Malinin.  That's a superstar designation.  Being a legend involves much more than success in one's sport, though.  One has to be an admirable human being at the same time.  The jury's out on Ilia right now.  Except for that one faux statement a while back we've got no reason to view Ilia negatively.  But a lack of negatives do not make a legend.  It is impossible to view Yuzu negatively (unless you're one of those who are determined to see him thus), but Yuzu's pluses are almost too numerous to list, though they boil down to his innate friendliness and courtesy (remember the Japanese can give the world lessons on courtesy), his willingness to help others and his intense interest in the phenomenon of figure skating.  Yuzu, it must be said, is a man on a mission, a mission to somehow reform figure skating and make it as pure and honest as possible.  He left figure skating in order to continue that campaign.  But he's dealing from a position of strength.  He is, after all, a living legend.  Only time will tell whether Ilia ever reaches those exalted heights.

[LAY]

14 hours ago, micaelis said:

OK, here it is.  I wanted to wait until Skate America was over before posting again about the new and (very much) improved Ilia Malinin.  He's worked closely with Shae-Lyn and the results are plain to see.  He took the Autumn Classic by 44 points, and took Skate America by 30 points, collecting a SP score over 100, a free skate program over 200 and total score over 300.  But those numbers really don't tell the whole story.  The program qualities do the job.  His short program is impressive but his free skate is so densely packed with detail you might think yourself watching Yuzu turned blond.  There's hardly a second when Ilia is not involved with doing something.  And he packed four quads into the mix, but what really strikes me is watching the details in the non-jumping part.  There's such a wealth to see and some of it is new to the sport.  Ilia's evidently looking at gymnasts and divers and seeing what they do and thinking if possible of adapting them to action on the ice.  Such is, for instance, his raspberry twist (I erroneously called it a twizzle in an earlier post). I was wondering where the 'raspberry' came from and evidently 'malinin' means 'raspberry' in Russian, a single-rotation jump done where the body is horizontal.  There are other quasi-jumps and such done during the choreographic sequence and along the way even when not doing one of the elements called for by the rules.  All of this prompted the commentator to say Ilia was from another planet (where have we heard that before but in connection with Yuzu) and also 'a superstar in the making'.

 

Which brings me to my main point and that is to distinguish between a superstar and a legend.  Yuzu became a superstar in the 2013-2014 season, taking gold at the GPF, Olympics and Worlds.  He was the dominant skater then and basically ruled the roost in the years following to the year of his retirement.  Even despite the fact that Nathan was the one taking the gold during those last years of Yuzu's competitive career, Yuzu was still the reference point.  It was Yuzu, not Nathan, who could fill all the seats in an arena and the ice show promoters knew it and acted accordingly.  Yuzu after retirement brought in Yuzu the professional and it can be said that the year following his retirement saw a massive statement about what an ice show could be, turning it from an entertainment into an experience.  What we've seen with Yuzu as he moved through his competition years was Yuzu building the foundations of Yuzu the legend, a legend which consisted of awesome skates, awesome audience response (those Poohvalanches or Poohbursts) which brought a new dimension to the notion of audience involvement in figure skating competitions.  And then there was Yuzu off the ice, Yuzu in Toronto basically living at TCC or at home.  No night life for him.  He was too involved with critiquing his skating and getting through his classes at Waseda University, where he ultimately earned a degree in cognitive science.  And back home in Japan, when he was there, we also saw him in all his efforts toward reconstruction after the earthquake, an event in which he had very personal and life-altering memories.  All of this made Yuzu in Japan a living icon, one of the most popular and respected individuals in that nation.  But there is also Yuzu's international fan-following, a phenomenon which those on this forum know well since they are a major part of it.  When we look at all of this we can easily see that Yuzu has already become a living legend.  And he will remain so.  Others may come along who also become legendary, but once a legend, always a legend.  What is a legend?  A legend is a person who is a cultural or historical reference point.  And that is exactly what Yuzu is.  A reference point and as a skater the Greatest of All Time.

 

Now we get to Ilia.  Ilia, to begin with, is young, very young although he entered senior level competing at a later age than Yuzu did.  Ilia's first season was that saw him medal at every event taking gold in all except the GPF and Worlds (bronzes there).  I don't know skating history in any great detail but is there any other skater in their rooky year at senior level who medaled in everything.  If there is please point him out.  Then there is the quad-axel, the Holy Grail of jumps.  Yuzu did all he could to make it happen and failed making the podium in Beijing in pursuit of it.  In Ilia's initial competition in the 22/23 season did it and proceeded to do it several times more to prove it wasn't a fluke.  On the strength of his full palette of jumps he coasted through the season but he had a lot of criticism about the quality of his skating.  His PC scores were lamentable.  In more than one interview he readily admitted so but indicated he would be putting major effort towards correcting that situation.  In his first competition of this season he showed he was quite serious about that and his PC scores, while not of Yuzu level were nevertheless quite respectable.  He took the competition by better than 40 points.  Then down in Texas this weekend at Skate America, competition he won last year (the youngest ever) he showed that the Canadian experience was not an outlier.  His margin in Texas was more than 30 points.  As a skater he's the genuine article.

 

I would think it very likely Ilia will be the poster-child of this Olympic cycle.  He IS a superstar in the making but what really makes a superstar goes far beyond the mastery of one's sport.  It needs charisma, something which Yuzu has in abundance and which Ilia also does.  It's different from Yuzu.  Ilia's not Japanese.  He's an American teenager whose great passion when not on the ice is skateboarding.  That is somebody people can readily identify with.  Also Ilia doesn't have an earthquake in his biography.  That gave Yuzu a major motive when pursuing his skating career.  He was proving to himself and to others that there is life after the quake.  Ilia's charisma is there, though, the sign being that there were a number of plush animals raining on the ice after Ilia's free skate performance.  Nothing on the scale of the avalanches of Poohs after Yuzu skated.  But it's early going.  The thing is that Ilia is quite good looking and that makes it easier to becoming a superstar.  But what really tells the tale is the smile on Ilia's face after a successful performance.  His smile is absolutely radiant, one of the best I've ever seen.  Interviews are another matter.  Ilia is not made for interviews.  He will come out with some pious platitudes but it is evident he doesn't have the depth of vision Yuzu has (again, no earthquake).  Yuzu has stared death in the face and has had to deal with the reality of thousands of deaths where he could have been one of them.  Eastern Virginia (Ilia's home turf) is not noted for earthquakes but if, for instance, an F5 tornado had torn through his home town and killed dozens and his home was spared while people just two blocks away had theirs blown apart and possibly their lives also, we might be seeing some sensitivity in Ilia's awareness.

 

In summary on Ilia, I think, unless a major meltdown occurs, that we are entering the Age of Malinin.  That's a superstar designation.  Being a legend involves much more than success in one's sport, though.  One has to be an admirable human being at the same time.  The jury's out on Ilia right now.  Except for that one faux statement a while back we've got no reason to view Ilia negatively.  But a lack of negatives do not make a legend.  It is impossible to view Yuzu negatively (unless you're one of those who are determined to see him thus), but Yuzu's pluses are almost too numerous to list, though they boil down to his innate friendliness and courtesy (remember the Japanese can give the world lessons on courtesy), his willingness to help others and his intense interest in the phenomenon of figure skating.  Yuzu, it must be said, is a man on a mission, a mission to somehow reform figure skating and make it as pure and honest as possible.  He left figure skating in order to continue that campaign.  But he's dealing from a position of strength.  He is, after all, a living legend.  Only time will tell whether Ilia ever reaches those exalted heights.

You should have posted this article in Ilia Malinin Skate America 2023 free skating YouTube video clip🤣

[Anni]

Jason about Yuzu

 

Quote

On skating in Yuzuru Hanyu’s show recently: Yuzu and his mom wished me good luck for Worlds and were grateful I came to do the show before the competition.  Yuzu is still the same, hasn’t changed at all, he is super professional as he always was.”

 

Source 

 

 

 

 

[NEWS]

[micaelis]

World Championships for 2024 are done and Ilia Malinin has taken gold.  When is the last time a skater in his 2nd season skating senior level has taken gold in the Grand Prix Final and in the World Championships?  I think it should be evident now that Ilia Malinin is the real thing, a figure skating in the making.  I'm anxious to watch the dynamics of his rise to fame and the means by which he has achieved it thus far.  Don't get me wrong.  He is not a threat to Yuzuru Hanyu.  Yuzu is that GOAT and Ilia will have to do a lot over these next few years to overshadow him but that is not the issue for me.  For me the issue is how a skater very different from Yuzu forms the foundation of being a living legend.  Ilia is not yet a living legend but he has put together a record now that makes him a valid candidate for such an exalted position.  And Yuzu is the one who started it all for Ilia, who credits Yuzu as being the initial inspiration for his going into figure skating and also the direct inspiration for his seeking and attaining the 4A.  In any case I go to bed this night happy with seeing Ilia Malinin as the newly-crowned World Champion.  I miss having Yuzu in competition so I've been looking around for a current contender.  Ilia is the one I chose partly because he's American and partly because he has a presence which none since Yuzu has had as far as I'm concerned.  So I sign off this night with the exclamation - HE DID IT!!!!