General Yuzuru Chat

[andchipzz]

21 minutes ago, Lunna said:

I don't completely agree with this. All that God-like concept it's what Shae-Lynn sees in the program and Yuzu himself can think of other things. I don't think you need to know the background to get into the program if choreography matches the music and that's Yuzu's case clearly. The only thing he needs is tons of stamina cuz FS is very demanding and also big jumps, at least 4Lz, cuz we know for what judges give out PCS nowdays.

From judge POV especially, since they are people who have been watching figure skating for a long time too, and following the history too, they will compare it especially to Plushenko's, which everyone know is a legendary performance. And choreography matching the music is just one step, to be able to influence the judges, the choreography needs to have something, a kind of confidence and inner energy.  And it must be supported by good stamina and health to perform well. If Yuzu wants to win with Origin, what he needs to convince is the judges, and knowing the judges, he must make it so, that the judges will not have any reason not to give all to him. Don't forget, that some of Yuzu's perfect 3As and quad jumps got very low GOE just because, so as unfortunate as the situation is, the big jump won't be enough for him. He will always be put on a different standard by the judges.

[Henni147]

I read so often that Yuzu has perfected Otonal at COR... I don't know... I just cannot agree with this...  Sure, it was a very strong performance and 110 is a huge score. Other skaters would kill to have a SP like that.

However, according to Yuzu-standards it was not perfect. He said himself that the combo was a bit shaky and the first half of the choreo is improvable, too imo. I don't say that it must be recycled, but it feels wrong for me to say that it's been perfected already. In that sense you can say that LGC has been perfected at GPF16, too, despite the shaky 4Lo... well, no, it hasn't.

[mercedes]

Well according to Yuzuru everything is rarely perfectbut I feel he has more of a final battle with Origin then with Otonal (also gong=4A) but as usual it's Yuzuru :we just have to wait(and not for long now).

 

And even if judges sometimes are a bunch of barbarians(just look at H&L score) I like to hope they know Origin is a tribute but not a copy ,also Yuzuru could really skate to Rasputin and sell it like hot cakes !

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Indiiea]

What is this? Mentioning the russian love machine so it will play at the back of my mind all day again? 

 

I think Origin will be majestic if he can perform it as well as H&L and Seimei.

[andchipzz]

58 minutes ago, Henni147 said:

I read so often that Yuzu has perfected Otonal at COR... I don't know... I just cannot agree with this...  Sure, it was a very strong performance and 110 is a huge score. Other skaters would kill to have a SP like that.

However, according to Yuzu-standards it was not perfect. He said himself that the combo was a bit shaky and the first half of the choreo is improvable, too imo. I don't say that it must be recycled, but it feels wrong for me to say that it's been perfected already. In that sense you can say that LGC has been perfected at GPF16, too, despite the shaky 4Lo... well, no, it hasn't.

 

Well, I agree that there can be some improvement done to Otonal, but it is already a World Record performance (unbroken). In a sense that for now, I hope he lets Otonal be, since it is a tribute program. It is already as good as it needs to be IMO. I dunno, it is up to him in the end, but strategically speaking, it is better to create a legendary signature performance that is purely his. Something that someone else can make a tribute of. 

 

48 minutes ago, Indiiea said:

What is this? Mentioning the russian love machine so it will play at the back of my mind all day again? 

 

I think Origin will be majestic if he can perform it as well as H&L and Seimei.

 

52 minutes ago, mercedes said:

Well according to Yuzuru everything is rarely perfectbut I feel he has more of a final battle with Origin then with Otonal (also gong=4A) but as usual it's Yuzuru :we just have to wait(and not for long now).

 

And even if judges sometimes are a bunch of barbarians(just look at H&L score) I like to hope they know Origin is a tribute but not a copy ,also Yuzuru could really skate to Rasputin and sell it like hot cakes !

What kind of foot twisting skating program will Rasputin be?  

[Lunna]

1 час назад, andchipzz сказал:

Don't forget, that some of Yuzu's perfect 3As and quad jumps got very low GOE just because, so as unfortunate as the situation is, the big jump won't be enough for him. He will always be put on a different standard by the judges.

Of course Yuzu must exceed expectations to have fair scores  just because, I mean that for high PCS the main trend now is that it goes with high TES and more or less mistakes free performance, great interpretation and SS itself will not give him high PCS (sad reality). So to be on top he must be complete package, not to give any judge a doubt, which he perfectly knows himself.

1 час назад, Henni147 сказал:

In that sense you can say that LGC has been perfected at GPF16, too, despite the shaky 4Lo... well, no, it hasn't.

For me it was, he was so cheeky after that saved 4Lo))) same with Otonal, maybe it can be cleaner but the mood and feeling at CoR was perfect. But this is of course my opinion, I'm sure Yuzu has another)))

[andchipzz]

3 minutes ago, Lunna said:

Of course Yuzu must exceed expectations to have fair scores  just because, I mean that for high PCS the main trend now is that it goes with high TES and more or less mistakes free performance, great interpretation and SS itself will not give him high PCS (sad reality). So to be on top he must be complete package, not to give any judge a doubt, which he perfectly knows himself.

 

It is as if he needs to be beyond humane to get high PCS. 

[KatjaThera]

I don't think judges judge Origin through Nijinsky comparisons, or else all warhorses would have to be judged based on legendary performances of that program. I also think Origin has a different feel than Nijinsky - which was why even Plush had issues at first, before he realized it was a tribute to him and not Nijinsky.

 

I get the perfection argument, though. There is something about Origin that makes it feel like it needs to be perfect.

 

That said, I also agree that quads are more essential to high scores than even better interpretation. Which is why I wonder if he might not be better off trying some of those new quads, even if adding more than one is likely to take longer to stabilize than adding them slowly, because he might get the "aww, he's going for hard quads!" bonus. It could be rougher, but might speed up things a bit. If he adds them one by one, it'll take time... he'll stabilize one, then probably it'll act up while he adds the next one and so on. But only he knows, based on stamina and health and so on.

 

As for Otonal being perfect, I think it's hard to argue that when it was forced into a different shape than originally intended after the kuyashii kicked in. Even if he pretty much made the best of it, overall, it was still more patched up than he'd like, I think.

 

But I, too, wonder about doing tribute programs two seasons in a row...

 

Well, Yuzu knows best and we'll see soon.

[andchipzz]

16 minutes ago, KatjaThera said:

I don't think judges judge Origin through Nijinsky comparisons, or else all warhorses would have to be judged based on legendary performances of that program. I also think Origin has a different feel than Nijinsky - which was why even Plush had issues at first, before he realized it was a tribute to him and not Nijinsky.

It is kinda subconscious thing, and judges need to judge, so they will subconsciously compare it to something that they already know as a point of reference. And I am sure that is how  PCS for warhorses program are judged, "is it better or worse compare to this or that legendary program? how much worse? how much better?". There will always be a benchmark.

And yes, for Origin, it needs to be a perfection to get full score. It needs to be clean, and maybe a 4A to reach that God-like effect Shae wanted. 

But eh, we must remember that both Otonal and Origin are initially programs that Yuzu wanted because he want to perform it, not because he thought he can definitely win with it. Of course, it is before he realized that more than anything else, he wants to be the absolute champion..

[KatjaThera]

53 minutes ago, andchipzz said:

It is kinda subconscious thing, and judges need to judge, so they will subconsciously compare it to something that they already know as a point of reference. And I am sure that is how  PCS for warhorses program are judged, "is it better or worse compare to this or that legendary program? how much worse? how much better?". There will always be a benchmark.

And yes, for Origin, it needs to be a perfection to get full score. It needs to be clean, and maybe a 4A to reach that God-like effect Shae wanted. 

But eh, we must remember that both Otonal and Origin are initially programs that Yuzu wanted because he want to perform it, not because he thought he can definitely win with it. Of course, it is before he realized that more than anything else, he wants to be the absolute champion..

Didn't Alina's Carmen get high PCS? Does that mean judges thought it was better than other Carmens?

 

I'm not saying it doesn't factor in, it probably depends from judge to judge, but I think TES counts more. Which, of course, is not to say TES will count more for Yuzu as well 😒 He usually seems to be judges by different criteria, so I wouldn't be surprised if it'll be the case on this, too.

[Lunna]

1 час назад, andchipzz сказал:

It is kinda subconscious thing, and judges need to judge, so they will subconsciously compare it to something that they already know as a point of reference. And I am sure that is how  PCS for warhorses program are judged, "is it better or worse compare to this or that legendary program? how much worse? how much better?". There will always be a benchmark.

I'm not sure judges have that long memory, they judge a lot of comps or they can simply might not even liked Plush's program back then (he was not everybody's cup skater). So I think you just dig too deep, now it's more like TES+politics (which was always there).

[monchan]

Why do I feel Yuzu would keep both programs . Cuz no media day and 'til this very moment there's no hint at all but the leaked Origin music?

I'm kinda convinced about Origin now so don't really hope for new FS. However I suppose the internet would EXPLODE if he revealed new SP at practice 

[mokjakarma]

1 hour ago, monchan said:

Why do I feel Yuzu would keep both programs . Cuz no media day and 'til this very moment there's no hint at all but the leaked Origin music?

There's a leaked Origin music??? 

[Veveco]

39 minutes ago, mokjakarma said:

There's a leaked Origin music??? 

There was a video of someone else training at TCC with a few seconds of Origin music in the background. So most people took it as confirmation that Yuzu is repeating Origin. 

[Sombreuil]

Had an email yesterday from Eurosport to say they were showing the skating this season.  However today their Twitter says it’s still undecided 🤷🏼‍♀️