General Skating Chat

[xeyra]

1 minute ago, Xen said:

...this is why I don't really like those two...Sure, but then the question is if the current version of Nate's PCS scores are high enough? It's actually fairly reasonable given his program, but certainly beatable and not especially huge (Shooms for comparison...), especially if Yuzu can nab a similar number of 10's as GPF15. On the other hand.. if the battle is on for Silver between Nate and the other men, then yes, definitely.

 

I don't think Yuzu is going to ever have that number of 10s again unless similar circumstances apply in a competition: he goes last and nails it after multiple good skates before him that will increase scores exponentially. GPF 2015 was special. 

[Xen]

1 minute ago, xeyra said:

So, in the end, what is the best strategy Yuzu can have to counteract this? Aim for that season-long consistency?

Yep....probably play Nate's strategy and just add the 4Lz later on. His layout regardless is more stable than Nate's yolo style. If he goes consistent with a 4Lz, then it's just him at the top, and Shoma and Nate battling it out for the remaining spots. I'm not sure right now where Boyang falls, but it's highly possible Boyang would add pressure to Nate and Shoma

[meoima]

7 minutes ago, xeyra said:

So, in the end, what is the best strategy Yuzu can have to counteract this? Aim for that season-long consistency?

I think Yuzuru's fans should just stay chill because he won't be clean back fo back whole season like he wants anyway.

I have read Yuzuru's interviews for 5-6 years? And he always aims for what his true nature isn't built for. 

I am not an old person, but old enough to understand your true nature will never change. Yuzuru will always be emotional and he will only do well in the right condition. But will you have the right conditions every time? No. So he has to accept that and embrace that.

This is why a bit of Javi's attitude is good for Yuzuru. Stay chilllll...

Lol his strategy is to stay calm and stay away from his own media people, stay as long as he could in Toronto because in Japan it's toxic from all sides lol. I hope I don't offend Japanese fans but when all around media news are saying he's old he's outdated he should step down, that they don't believe in him then better to stay away. 

His true layout is enough to win Olympic if he does well.

Believe in Yuzuru. 

 

[Neenah]

I think Yuzu is fine. If you look at his results last season you can see that he still holds the highest GOE even when he is not clean and his PC while taking a hit (same as Patrick) was still high, the judges do recognize the quality of his elements and know how good he is. What he needs is to be clean few times (especially in the SP) so that the judges would not dismiss him as gold medal contender like they did at Worlds, and of course the skating order will play part of how they score him.

[Xen]

6 minutes ago, meoima said:

I think Yuzuru's fans should just stay chill because he won't be clean back fo back whole season like he wants anyway.

I have read Yuzuru's interviews for 5-6 years? And he always aims for what his true nature isn't built for. 

I am not an old person, but old enough to understand your true nature will never change. Yuzuru will always be emotional and he will only do well in the right condition. But will you have the right conditions every time? No. So he has to accept that and embrace that.

This is why a bit of Javi's attitude is good for Yuzuru. Stay chilllll...

Lol his strategy is to stay calm and stay away from his own media people, stay as long as he could in Toronto because in Japan it's toxic from all sides lol. I hope I don't offend Japanese fans but when all around media news are saying he's old he's outdated he should step down, that they don't believe in him then better to stay away. 

His true layout is enough to win Olympic if he does well.

Believe in Yuzuru. 

 

I wonder if that's why Javi and Yuzu are both at ACI...to chill each other a bit and to egg each other on a bit!

[meoima]

7 minutes ago, Xen said:

I wonder if that's why Javi and Yuzu are both at ACI...to chill each other a bit and to egg each other on a bit!

Yuzuru will eat Javi alive... because he's that extra 

[FCSSp4]

10 minutes ago, xeyra said:

So, in the end, what is the best strategy Yuzu can have to counteract this? Aim for that season-long consistency?

Keep aiming for the highest average. He doesn't have to be clean all the time, that's what Brian tried to tell him at JP Nats '15-16 (and it retrospect the latter half of 15-16 is a sad lesson for him). Back then SEIMEI @ GPF was the benchmark for 'perfection' but now he has surpassed that in just one season. There's no need for him to keep creating pressure for himself when everyone else seems bent on doing it for him.

[Forcefield]

28 minutes ago, Xen said:

Yep....probably play Nate's strategy and just add the 4Lz later on. His layout regardless is more stable than Nate's yolo style. If he goes consistent with a 4Lz, then it's just him at the top, and Shoma and Nate battling it out for the remaining spots. I'm not sure right now where Boyang falls, but it's highly possible Boyang would add pressure to Nate and Shoma

 

Boyang in these circumstances remind me of Javi. Javi is to Yuzuru what Boyang will be to Chen and Shoma. Quietly (to an extent) moving in when all the the hype is on one side, I bet. i.e. Javi became 2x World Champion when it seemed Yuzu got it in the bag.

 

Yuzu, Nathan, and Shoma are all aiming for the OGM, while I feel like Jin and Javi, while being very capable skaters themselves, will just be happy with an Olympic medal this round. And that's dangerous in situations when the ones at the top falls too hard.

 

And I know I'm missing Patrick, but well, that's another analogy.

[xeyra]

9 minutes ago, FCSSp4 said:

Keep aiming for the highest average. He doesn't have to be clean all the time, that's what Brian tried to tell him at JP Nats '15-16 (and it retrospect the latter half of 15-16 is a sad lesson for him). Back then SEIMEI @ GPF was the benchmark for 'perfection' but now he has surpassed that in just one season. There's no need for him to keep creating pressure for himself when everyone else seems bent on doing it for him.

 

Yeah. Pretty much. He doesn't need to be squeaky clean all the time, he just needs to maintain a higher average and not have such big lows as he's prone to have at the beginning of the season. 

[Yatagarasu]

49 minutes ago, Xen said:

Yep....probably play Nate's strategy and just add the 4Lz later on. 

 

There are pros and cons to everything and adding the 4Lz later on also has these so I don't think he'll wait that long. Doing it in competition is completely different to practice so when you look at the upcoming competitions, it's really NHK that sort of stands as the latest possible option, if he wants  enough time to incorporate it properly because post that? GPF, J Nats and Olympics. All of those are important.

 

Personally, I actually believe that he is capable of pulling off his high-average season. 
We'll see.

 

Quote

I'm not sure right now where Boyang falls, but it's highly possible Boyang would add pressure to Nate and Shoma

 

I feel really sorry for Boyang actually. Having seen Nathan's FS and prior to that Boyang's FS all I can say is uh oh, did he get screwed over. I am not even sure what he can do right now. Go back to the previous season's program and aim for stability with an increase difficulty seems like the best option for me but in any case I do hope Team China is taking a very, very close look at his situation and I hope they choose wisely. 

 

 

 

[xeyra]

18 minutes ago, Yatagarasu said:

I feel really sorry for Boyang actually. Having seen Nathan's FS and prior to that Boyang's FS all I can say is uh oh, did he get screwed over. I am not even sure what he can do right now. Go back to the previous season's program and aim for stability with an increase difficulty seems like the best option for me but in any case I do hope Team China is taking a very, very close look at his situation and I hope they choose wisely. 

 

Whoever cut his FS music did him a bit of a disservice. I love The Planets/Star Wars music but the way Boyang's FS music was patched together is just so disconnected from each other. Especially the Cantina theme for his step sequence in the middle of super somber pieces. He should have gone the Zhenya route and put some Darth Vader breathing sounds capping the step sequence, to transition into the somberness of a post-Vader attack or something. 

[Saya]

Nathan has the advantage of being comfortable with his quads, which is why he has no problem with gradually incorporating them/improvising. Yuzuru on the other hand never landed the 4Lz in competition, and as we all know, he is not the fastest to adapt to his new layouts...So, no. I don't think he's going for the same strategy.

 

  On a side note, I really wanted Yuzuru to pull a 4lo combo...He always goes for new quad combos the season after he gained some consistency with the solo quad (i.e 4S) Maybe he doesn't think his loop is that reliable yet.

[meoima]

30 minutes ago, Yatagarasu said:

 

There are pros and cons to everything and adding the 4Lz later on also has these so I don't think he'll wait that long. Doing it in competition is completely different to practice so when you look at the upcoming competitions, it's really NHK that sort of stands as the latest possible option, if he wants  enough time to incorporate it properly because post that? GPF, J Nats and Olympics. All of those are important.

 

Personally, I actually believe that he is capable of pulling off his high-average season. 
We'll see.

 

 

I feel really sorry for Boyang actually. Having seen Nathan's FS and prior to that Boyang's FS all I can say is uh oh, did he get screwed over. I am not even sure what he can do right now. Go back to the previous season's program and aim for stability with an increase difficulty seems like the best option for me but in any case I do hope Team China is taking a very, very close look at his situation and I hope they choose wisely. 

 

 

 

I don't think he should wait several competitions to add the 4lz, after all he has been practicing it for a while. But of course going against Javi at AU where Canadian might prefer Javi over Yuzuru lol it's hard to say.

[meoima]

57 minutes ago, Saya said:

Nathan has the advantage of being comfortable with his quads, which is why he has no problem with gradually incorporating them/improvising. Yuzuru on the other hand never landed the 4Lz in competition, and as we all know, he is not the fastest to adapt to his new layouts...So, no. I don't think he's going for the same strategy.

 

  On a side note, I really wanted Yuzuru to pull a 4lo combo...He always goes for new quad combos the season after he gained some consistency with the solo quad (i.e 4S) Maybe he doesn't think his loop is that reliable yet.

I wouldn't say that Nathan is more comfortable with quads especially when Nathan only did 3 quads in total at US classic. His strategy is that he adds the PCS first and then the quads later and maybe ignore some transitions or difficult moves in the long run. But there is no guarantee that it will work well in the end. We don't know and frankly Nathan himself doesn't know either. That's why he only did 3 quads at US Classic. To PR his "potential". But we all know plan and the reality might differ. 

What makes Nathan comfortable most is that he can be happy with his current choices, not doing many quads and US media will just jump in to protect him (see how Jackie Wong is going out with all his force to say Nathan is only testing out). 

 

Javi also has the same luxury because frankly Spanish media will care nothing about the number of quads his rivals do.

 

Yuzuru does not have that luxury, Japanese media and some of  his own people, will trash him like there is no end if he doesn't do 5 quads right at the beginning of the season. He will do 4lz at Autumn Classic or not I don't know but I am sure there will be hundreds of media trash him for a mistake even if he lands 4lz lol. 

 

And this is why I think JSF isn't smart but who am I to tell them lol. Their media and the fed are too busy creating rivalries for their own skaters and totally forget they might make their top skaters worn out too soon. 

 

All they want is some constant wins and forget that, whatever truly matters will be at the Olympic, not the inflated and unrealistic scores at senior B or even GP. 

 

See US classical doesn't care to boost scores too much. It's unnecessary for the time being. USFA will play their political games, but not here during this time, it will be at Skate America and US national.

[Lunna]

1 час назад, FCSSp4 сказал:

Keep aiming for the highest average. He doesn't have to be clean all the time, that's what Brian tried to tell him at JP Nats '15-16 (and it retrospect the latter half of 15-16 is a sad lesson for him). Back then SEIMEI @ GPF was the benchmark for 'perfection' but now he has surpassed that in just one season. There's no need for him to keep creating pressure for himself when everyone else seems bent on doing it for him.

I think clean and stable SP will be very nice to have - cuz it can help to create an image of a stable skater, a stumble or two in FS will not matter that much cuz there're many elements in it.