General Yuzuru Chat

[OmNom]

All the talk about 4A and quints (what even?!) is making me equal part anxious and excited.

I am training to be an applied mathematician in physical field, the math of quintuple jumps make my hips and knees tingle.

So glad to see Yuzu back at TCC (and yes, how on earth he looks 16? oh, well. He is in his own planet, so...) and hopefully, more news start coming in.

 

I have a question, but I am so afraid to open a potential can of worms. Have just started following Yuzu since 2014 (and has just recently decided to be more involved), and so do not know his history before then.

I had a conversation on tumblr the other day, and was given the impression that I would understand better Yuzu's somewhat awkward relationship with JFS if I know what happened in 2012 Japanese National. I mean I got the gist of it, I think, but I am not sure. Anyone got links to any discussion about that? If you would pretty please pm me? Thank you! :bow: :bow: :bow:

 

When in doubt, always ask meoima :smile:

[mcq]

this is awesome analysis and i agree that yuzu's jumps are very high and far

his position in the air is good and he holds his body tightly in a good posture so he spins fast when in the air

what you said about the height and air time is very interesting ... do you remember where you read this? cuz i'd love to read it too! :grin:

and not only lighter boots, but the boots also have to be very strong because of the extra impact forces...?

 

I can PM you if you want to see the jump height analysis.

 

Very insightful analysis, mcq! :clap: :clap:

I agree a lot with the concern about height. Certain body types just don't allow you to jump very high, it's not something you can work on to improve. So even if one skater has a good 3A, he might never be able to fully complete 4.5 rotations for the same jump. Especially if you look at 'easier' quads he can land and see that his airtime for the quad is almost the same as that for the triple

 

He can land a 4S from almost no speed (without much prerotation), while many skaters struggle to land and fully rotate a quad even with setting-ups that take 10 hours. :p

His airtime for the triple is shorter than his airtime for quad. But some of his triple (like 3lz for example) could have more to almost similar airtime to his 3A or 4S. He actually has the most airtime for 4T, due to more height that he achieved there.

[randomanon]

The reason why people think it is him who can land it is because he jumps pretty big and he rotates fast. This is a jump that really needs height and that extra airtime. Speed can help you get more height, maybe, but it is height mostly that is needed to get this jump happening. Yuzu can jump 3A from a stand still and land (+fully rotate) it quite often, moreso than others who spend 1000 years setting up for their 3A and still flop it; so speed imo does not play much role as long as you can get the height needed. More speed can get you more distance too, though it does not necessarily mean you will get more airtime. I actually read the jump height analysis someone made, and airtime is highly dependent on the height, not the distance/speed. Those with similar height of their jump will get almost identical airtime, regardless of their speed.

Due to these, you can rule out those that jump small and those who do not rotate fast + have tight air position. Hence, not many people left available.

I also think you probably need lighter boots to make it happen.

 

mmmmh I get how distance doesn't really factor into airtime but how come not speed? Or does speed just affect the flow in/out ...

[OmNom]

 

mmmmh I get how distance doesn't really factor into airtime but how come not speed? Or does speed just affect the flow in/out ...

 

speed doesn't guarantee springiness, I think? you can still rotate very fast while leaving the ice in a short amount of time.. We have plenty of examples like satoko, yulia, shoma etc.

[kaeryth]

Don't worry guys... he won't do a quint since (as Yuzuru has stated) ISU doesn't have a scoring for it... yet...

But the fact that he has researched about it makes me worried. hahaha...

[Joey]

I can PM you if you want to see the jump height analysis.

 

Me too please :space:

[mcq]

The reason why people think it is him who can land it is because he jumps pretty big and he rotates fast. This is a jump that really needs height and that extra airtime. Speed can help you get more height, maybe, but it is height mostly that is needed to get this jump happening. Yuzu can jump 3A from a stand still and land (+fully rotate) it quite often, moreso than others who spend 1000 years setting up for their 3A and still flop it; so speed imo does not play much role as long as you can get the height needed. More speed can get you more distance too, though it does not necessarily mean you will get more airtime. I actually read the jump height analysis someone made, and airtime is highly dependent on the height, not the distance/speed. Those with similar height of their jump will get almost identical airtime, regardless of their speed.

Due to these, you can rule out those that jump small and those who do not rotate fast + have tight air position. Hence, not many people left available.

I also think you probably need lighter boots to make it happen.

 

mmmmh I get how distance doesn't really factor into airtime but how come not speed? Or does speed just affect the flow in/out ...

 

Speed may help you get more height, but higher speed will not get you more airtime without the height? Think of it this way, say skater A jump 30 cm and has speed of 15 km/h while skater B jumps with the speed of 25 km/h and also 30 cm, what will likely result is similar airtime but skater B would have more distance in his jump than skater A?

This is why Yuzuru's jump seems bigger because of his speed coming in, thus more distance for his jumps?

[xeyra]

Quoting myself with a question I had this morning but in the middle of the 4A talk it got lost. Does anyone know more on how this works?

 

I have a question that is only tangentially related to Yuzu, but I've been reading here and elsewhere how Shae-Lynn Bourne was busy for a week with Elena Radionova, choreographing her program, and I wonder... do choreographers spend entire days with a single skater while doing their programs? It seems weird to me that all through that week Shae couldn't have worked with other people on their choreographies, especially if the skaters came to her at her usual workplace, and not the other way around. So in a single day or a single week, she would only work with one person?

[Yatagarasu]

Don't worry guys... he won't do a quint since (as Yuzuru has stated) ISU doesn't have a scoring for it... yet...

But the fact that he has researched about it makes me worried. hahaha...

 

Well with Oda talking about the Chinese guys possibly landing quints ... yeah, good luck to us all after the Olympics are over.

[meoima]

Don't worry guys... he won't do a quint since (as Yuzuru has stated) ISU doesn't have a scoring for it... yet...

But the fact that he has researched about it makes me worried. hahaha...

Well with Oda talking about the Chinese guys possibly landing quints ... yeah, good luck to us all after the Olympics are over.

The only Chinese guy who can do quint is Boyang and there is no news about that. And the reality is most skaters struggle to get 3.75 rotation on air, how can get they 4.75 rotation on air to get a quint. Unless they want to try 4.25 rotation on air and get it called a quint by some very very low standard.

[randomanon]

 

Speed may help you get more height, but higher speed will not get you more airtime without the height? Think of it this way, say skater A jump 30 cm and has speed of 15 km/h while skater B jumps with the speed of 25 km/h and also 30 cm, what will likely result is similar airtime but skater B would have more distance in his jump than skater A?

This is why Yuzuru's jump seems bigger because of his speed coming in, thus more distance for his jumps?

 

Ah okay I see, thanks for the great explanation! :goe:

[yuzupon]

All the talk about 4A and quints (what even?!) is making me equal part anxious and excited.

I am training to be an applied mathematician in physical field, the math of quintuple jumps make my hips and knees tingle.

So glad to see Yuzu back at TCC (and yes, how on earth he looks 16? oh, well. He is in his own planet, so...) and hopefully, more news start coming in.

 

I have a question, but I am so afraid to open a potential can of worms. Have just started following Yuzu since 2014 (and has just recently decided to be more involved), and so do not know his history before then.

I had a conversation on tumblr the other day, and was given the impression that I would understand better Yuzu's somewhat awkward relationship with JFS if I know what happened in 2012 Japanese National. I mean I got the gist of it, I think, but I am not sure. Anyone got links to any discussion about that? If you would pretty please pm me? Thank you! :bow: :bow: :bow:

 

When in doubt, always ask meoima :smile:

 

Got it. I am asking her. Thanks :yes: !

 

About the quints, based on the calculations I've seen, it is indeed humanly possible to do (however hard it is). It's just that with the built of 'average' skaters (and by that I mean somewhat lean, medium height, and not too muscled), they would need to cover the ice so much for the jump preparation, that I am not sure how that would be incorporated into a program with a coreo.

I'd be awesome if we can somehow have a calculation costumised exactly for Yuzu. :pbow:

[kaeryth]

Don't worry guys... he won't do a quint since (as Yuzuru has stated) ISU doesn't have a scoring for it... yet...

But the fact that he has researched about it makes me worried. hahaha...

 

Well with Oda talking about the Chinese guys possibly landing quints ... yeah, good luck to us all after the Olympics are over.

 

I'm hoping ISU doesn't give quints any base value... I'm already worried about juniors doing quads.

The 4A ,however, has a base value that Yuzuru is very much aware of so that for sure would be his goal.

Wasn't it his childhood dream to "land a jump with 4.5 revolutions"? I swear that little mushroom has no chill.

But then again, he's also amazing in that he's able to fulfill his dreams - that Olympic gold medal after the Vancouver games for example.

[yuzu_huasheng]

I need to learn English hard.very thank you!

[Yatagarasu]

The only Chinese guy who can do quint is Boyang and there is no news about that. And the reality is most skaters struggle to get 3.75 rotation on air, how can get they 4.75 rotation on air to get a quint. Unless they want to try 4.25 rotation on air and get it called a quint by some very very low standard.

 

Weeeellllllllll ......... :grin:

I actually agree but I think I'd bet him on trying post-Olympics just for the fun of it in practice. To see. I fully expect him to do the 4A then, in terms of serious practice and well, that's already 4.5