Flexibility Issue (vs jumps)

[Fay]

3 hours ago, SparkleSalad said:

 

In Australia it would definitely be classified as child abuse. They go around in considerable pain for weeks afterwards but after that they have the splits for life. I'd never do that to a child but from what my friend said of the Russian training, that wasn't the only awful thing they did (creepy coaches and now what everyone knows about drugs for Olympic athletes.)

 

But that's super off topic.

 

No, it's actually perfectly on topic. I remember seeing rhythmic gymnasts doing their stretch exercises - the younger of them were literally crying because it was so painful - and I felt so sorry for them. I also had a student whose daughter was a rhythmic gymnast up until recently (they had to give up because she was deemed to be too small and too short to ever make an elite gymnast) - coaches were always on the lookout for girls with superflexible joints like you, because that's what gave them a headstart. But I wonder if the most flexible of them are quite as quite as good jumpers - Alina Kabaeva could do wonders with her body flexibility, but she didn't jump as high as others, I think.

[Murieleirum]

4 hours ago, SparkleSalad said:

 

I have friend who trained in Russia as a gymnast when she was young. One day they just took the kids and forced them into splits. No gradual natural stretching, just *SNAP*. They do this with sumo wrestlers in Japan and I've seen the same in documentaries on gymnastics and kung fu schools in China.

 

So I think there's a difference with naturally, genetically flexible people and those who have worked at or had flexibility forced upon them. 

 

That sounds terrible. I've been flexibility training for half a year by now, almost every day, but still I've got no full splits. I am pretty chill about it, since I never did dance or anything, but if someone did that to me I'd get traumatized... plus, isn't there serious risk for joints injury or something?

Well, maybe less risk with young kids... but if I did it at 20, I think it wouldn't be the same story xD

 

[ralucutzagy]

3 hours ago, Fay said:

 

No, it's actually perfectly on topic. I remember seeing rhythmic gymnasts doing their stretch exercises - the younger of them were literally crying because it was so painful - and I felt so sorry for them. I also had a student whose daughter was a rhythmic gymnast up until recently (they had to give up because she was deemed to be too small and too short to ever make an elite gymnast) - coaches were always on the lookout for girls with superflexible joints like you, because that's what gave them a headstart. But I wonder if the most flexible of them are quite as quite as good jumpers - Alina Kabaeva could do wonders with her body flexibility, but she didn't jump as high as others, I think.

Yana Kudryavtseva was pure perfection for her sport!! I was a big fan! So sorry for her bad luck at the Olympics and so sorry that she r****d! 

But I guess this is off topic! LOL But I can't retain remembering her, she was a genius!!

[SparkleSalad]

3 hours ago, Fay said:

 

No, it's actually perfectly on topic. I remember seeing rhythmic gymnasts doing their stretch exercises - the younger of them were literally crying because it was so painful - and I felt so sorry for them. I also had a student whose daughter was a rhythmic gymnast up until recently (they had to give up because she was deemed to be too small and too short to ever make an elite gymnast) - coaches were always on the lookout for girls with superflexible joints like you, because that's what gave them a headstart. But I wonder if the most flexible of them are quite as quite as good jumpers - Alina Kabaeva could do wonders with her body flexibility, but she didn't jump as high as others, I think.

 

The poor girl. These intersecting worlds of art and sport are very cruel. I don't have the small frame for ballet so my dreams would have been crushed eventually had my body held up. I feel so sad seeing promising junior skaters grow into bodies they can't control as well anymore. 

 

I'm nowhere near as flexible as these skaters but I never really bothered stretching because I never had to. For example, I was never able to stretch my thigh muscles without bringing my foot around the side, same with crossing my arms over to stretch my shoulders - no resistance at all. I never got full splits but was very close without putting in a second of effort. I'm glad I was lazy with it, though - I'm sure I'd be suffering a great deal more if I'd pushed myself.

 

I know little about the mechanics of jumping but I can tell it requires an awful lot of muscle power and joint stability and I wouldn't think flexibility would be an advantage, even if it's not a disadvantage, because you have to be more careful with how you build muscle in the first place.  Even now I have trouble, for example, building up my shoulders and pectorals because my bones move too far out of place before I can engage any muscles. Kind of like when you tighten a bottle cap so tight that it twists back over to loose again. I've also been injured doing pretty low key training with a personal trainer (before I really realised I was abnormal) which rendered me unable to climb stairs without pain (or very carefully) for several years. I really have to be way more careful than normal about keeping myself aligned during exercise to avoid injury. I don't even want to imagine trying to bear the impact of landing misaligned jumps (slo-mo Shoma videos hurt to watch.)

 

But I'm sure athletes get all the tailored training and support they need. For a person like me whose fitness is of no importance to anyone's financial success, muscle training is a pain. 

 

None of this really does much to answer the question bur perhaps something might interest someone.

[yuzuangel]

On 5/31/2017 at 03:26, Murieleirum said:

 

That sounds terrible. I've been flexibility training for half a year by now, almost every day, but still I've got no full splits. I am pretty chill about it, since I never did dance or anything, but if someone did that to me I'd get traumatized... plus, isn't there serious risk for joints injury or something?

Well, maybe less risk with young kids... but if I did it at 20, I think it wouldn't be the same story xD

 

Yeah, it's difficult. I've also been doing it for a while too but gave up because I didn't seem to get far. I think I'm about as flexible as when I started. I have friends who never stretch and they can naturally do splits.

 

When I stretch for a long time, I can get the splits, but that requires maybe 20 minutes of of "warming up." I would keep stretching if it wasn't kind of painful, and due to having the attention span of a fly I can't stay in one position for very long without feeling antsy.

[ralucutzagy]

Flexible ... 

 

s:tumblr.com/kichessarjilian

[SparkleSalad]

Someone posted a link to this translation from Aoi Honoo II in another thread and flexibility and stability is mentioned briefly:

 

https://yuzusorbet.tumblr.com/post/148632005622/bits-from-chapter-2-of-aoi-hono-ii-yuzus-2nd

 

"He talked about how the body gets more rigid as one grows older and there was a recent period where he found it a bit hard to do the biellmann spin. There is a trade-off because when he was very flexible, it was harder to have stable jumps.  But now, he feels it is alright.  He has found the right balance between being flexible and having strong muscles for jumping quads."

 

[Aotoshiro]

On 3.06.2017 at 7:23 AM, sublimeskating said:

 

   that sounds incredibly painful OMG!!!

 

 

IKR???  holy cow!!!  that's terrifying!!!

That is terryfying, especially when you remember You're speaking about a country where a still living writer (Maria Arbatowa- original of the book is called "меня 46" or "I'm 46" but I remember my language translation deviating from it quite a lot) described her rehab on a limping leg like what survivors describe nazi camps. It was just the popular belief- if you weren't healthy enough to work, you brought shame upon your family and you should be grateful to your country for taking care of you, even if it looked more like a jail than a school. Then, few years later she writes about the situation in the hospital- where the children weren't given the sedatives because "they weren't feeling the pain like the adults" according to the doctors... So, if this was a belief in the, say 70. who can guarantee the idea of "soft bones" and "not feeling pain like adults" didn't remain? and while soft bones could technically be true (oversimplizing, but still), I don't think it apply to soft joints...but then again, people did strange things to their children to give them a chance to be good for society/ beautiful (foot binding, anyone?)

 

There is so many things that get into figure skating that being simply "Flexible" isn't leading you anywhere, especially if it is "fixed" flexibility. Yuzuru admitted to being flexible since the youngest age, but just as Arakawa, he made a point of having to train to maintain it- just as he has to do with the muscles that keeps joints in place, and those that are needed to jump, or the skating skills to maintain the precision. 

[raviola]

On 5/30/2017 at 10:24 PM, SparkleSalad said:

 

I have friend who trained in Russia as a gymnast when she was young. One day they just took the kids and forced them into splits. No gradual natural stretching, just *SNAP*. They do this with sumo wrestlers in Japan and I've seen the same in documentaries on gymnastics and kung fu schools in China.

 

So I think there's a difference with naturally, genetically flexible people and those who have worked at or had flexibility forced upon them. 

Boyang Jin's mother once said in an interview that what "broke her heart the most" was watching her son do flexibility training for the first time because he "screamed like he was being torn" 

Link to interview:  https://youtu.be/eVu67BSh2Lg?t=2m10s

[Dreamer]

wow....I can't...read accounts like that.  That is torture!!