Joey

Well the ladies is so close that it's halfway impossible to do more then random guessing, and the men.... eehhhhh... so yeah, I'm 100% team random this time too

Hey everyone, the quiz for the JGPF, containing Ladies & Men, is ready: https://www.flexiquiz.com/SC/N/71c7996d-d2c4-4ba8-93e6-365d344e4b95 As said before, wou'll have to predict the full 6 placements this time, and there are additional bonus questions. Good luck! Quiz for Seniors is coming tomorrow, after the deadline for WDs is over ^^"

Those examples make it sound like the rules under 6.0 basically were: Russians: the technicians Americans: the artists Asians: don't exist Which is probably not to far from how the judges viewed things xD

I would agree partly, but definitely not for all Eteri girls. While very talented, I do think Alina for example is currently still a bit overstrained to keep up with the complexity of her programs, and ends up looking quite a bit rushed, unfinished, and in single moments IMO even a bit "clunky". Evgenia was similar at the start of her senior career, but for me has majorly outgrown it. But then Polina Tsurskaya is also a Eteri girl, and I think she is completely different in that regard. She takes a lot more time to finish her movements, her choreo is still complex compared to the average senior lady, but much less so then Zhenya/Alina. It helps that she has way stronger basic SS then those 2 though (she has among the strongest SS in senior ladies right now IMO. But she usually gets forgotten in those discussions). There are also the Junior girls - where I think Aljona, and partly Sasha & Nastya - can give very good performances despite their choreo being so complex (just a random comparison, those girls have more complexity into their SP solo jumps then quite a few senior skaters in their whole choreographic sequence). Obviously, they don't have Kostner level performances, but then they are also 13-14 As for the live vs on screen discussion - I personally actually don't think that the differences are that huge, but yes quite some skaters get some extra seeing them live (or loss some). Some examples from my experiences: the biggest change for me was in ID. I always was team Shibs > Chock/Bates during 2014-15 & the start of 2015-16, until I saw both teams live. The Shibs excel in areas that look good on screen: very clean & tidy in what they do, good musical timing, lovely details. C/B on the other hand were faster, more powerful, and especially Madison had amazing projection IMO. She gave me the feeling I saw her "up closer" then the others, like she was right in front of me, because there was just so much presence and her movements were very "big". Next to them, the Shibs looked smaller and more "contained" in what they did. Ashley Wagner was a funny case for me - her PE comes across even better live, as she has good projection and really knows how to sell her stuff. Like, really. But her weak basic SS are more obvious too, given how every time there is some form of complex footwork, she slows down a lot (and her step sequences cover very little ice. Like, comparing them from WC17, Mai or Waka cover 4x as much ice during theirs). Gracie Gold looked better live too, speed & power were very clear, but she also looked similarly wooden to on screen for me. Satoko is a similar case as the Shibs, she didn't really reach out as much and looked quite small in her skating, while Kaori was way more impressive live. She doesn't have the refinement or same amount of details, but she is very fast and also has this "just throwing myself into this" thing that gets me personally hooked. Waka & Mai look similar between live & on screen to me. Their speed comes across even more live too, but overall their skating works in both media. On the men's side, a lot of people say "You have to watch Chan live to get it!", but I don't agree. His amazing basic SS are undeniable either way to me, but I also don't think his projection is the greatest. Regarding Yuzu, I think he's another one who looks great either way, but yes live there is that extra something there. He has a command over the arena (when he's on) that doesn't quite translate like that on screen. What also sticks out is how unusual his layouts are - Yuzu has a lot more jumps only set up over the short ends of the rink then most other guys. Stuff like this I think is often overlooked on screen. Overall though, seeing skaters live is fun, especially if you factor the whole atmosphere in an arena in. But I rarely set there and thought "man, I never understood why that skater get's 9's in PCS, now I think she/he should get 10's!". But then, all just my opinion of course.

No worries ^^ And yeah, regarding waiting for the deadline... it also doesn't give us much time though, as I think the competition starts on thursday. This season doesn't want to make it easy for us, does it... D=

@Xen Well, this is why I wanted to wait until this weekend to even get the GPF rounds out... because I figured with so many possible WDs, it might make no sense before. (Sad to know it happened, but it's also good they're taking care of their health first. Heal well Boyasha & Zhenya!) I'm not sure which lists you mean? The GPF line-ups now? Men: Shoma, Nathan, Mikhail, Sergei, Adam, Jason. Ladies: Alina, Caro, Kaetlyn, Maria, Wakaba, Satoko.

Uhm, I don't want to be ~that~ fan, that can apparently see nothing wrong or no weakness, but if Yuzu apparently doesn't appeal to "causal viewers", how was he by far and away and by lightyears in front of everyone else the break out star of the last Olympic season in men's? Of course it depends on the program, and H&L might not appeal to casual viewers because it's so introverted, without a clear highlight and so on. But Seimei & Chopin? You bet. LGC? Etude? R&J1? PW? Yes, yes, and yes. In fact, I remember I had friends over in 2014 to watch Olys together who normally know no skating at all. They majorly arrived having seen something of Yuzu before - in German media (don't ask me where they caught it, I'm still shocked myself) - and the first thing one said was "That Japanese kid is skating, right? Man, no way he doesn't win this easily, he's so charismatic!". So, 'my' casual viewers beg to differ

Aka the smily reaction trajectory of someone who thinks IN is his biggest strength. Yes, there, I said it. Over his god level transitions, over his absolute top-notch SS. Over his complex, often unique and detailed choreo. And over his commanding presence and intensity giving his performances the "you will watch this!" extra. The. Best. Part. I am sorry Max & Angelo, I love you dearly, but you are most certainly off my list of trusted advisers for the best Interpretation in Figure Skating Christmas Party list. Though truth be told, if we look back at Max screaming "Interpretation - 10!" after WC17's Hope & Legacy... I will just assume they wanted to try and name some others, because maybe "Yuzuru Hanyu invented skating and deserves 11 in every category" didn't sound quite as professional as bringing some other names in. I have faith

That's the spirit! Okay, Junior ladies & men included too then ^^ (I'll make a separate questionnaire for them though, so that it's not one too stuffed one)

I wouldn't have planed on doing the Juniors, because I'm not sure if enough here are watching those - but if people want to, I'd love to do it. Especially since the Junior ladies really deserve all the attention this season, such an amazing field! So, who'd want to guess them too?

Closing out the "general" GP predictions, results for Skate America are here! We actually did a bit better then at IdF again, so congrats everyone! Winners of the SA round with 28 points are Hannah, Kizuna & SallyCinnamon. Close 2nd goes to YuzuPon & Neenah with 27, followed by Sayu93 with 26 points in 3rd. Sally won the men's with 13 points; Kaeryth the ladies with 8; golden, Hannah, YuzuPon & YT Pairs with 9; and Kizuna & Nennah Dance with our only perfect scores, 14 points. Congrats! As for the bonus questions & answers: How many clean 3A will we see in the Mens SP? It were only 5 (hopefully Yuzu didn't see that!), so the right answer is 3 - 5. (Since the question had 5 possible answer, right answer gave you 3 points. Being 'one off' still got you one point) Will all the US ladies place in the top 6? No, Karen finished 8th. Will D/R & S/M have the highest TES overall? No, Y/Z did. Will the top5 after the SD be the same as the overall top 5? No, they were not. Going over to the overall standing after the 6 GPs, this time everyone included so you see where you are going into the final: 1. Yatagarasu - 173 2. Joey - 170 3. Sally Cinnamon - 169 4. Kelly - 167 5 ralucutzagy - 164 6. kitsune - 161 7. Xeyra - 158 8. golden - 157 9. Moni - 156 10. Lily Ng - 155 11. Hannah, YuzuPon - 148 12. Crazykuroneko, Fayruza, Sombreuil, Neenah - 147 13. Kaeryth - 145 14. Lil Sailor - 140 15. Sayu93, YT - 139 16. Oh Yuzu - 137 17. Singcarcom - 135 18. Kizuna - 134 19. Smultron - 129 20. novana - 121 21. LadyLou - 116 22. nuitsuki, Xen - 105 23. PapiandPooh421 - 72 24. freeyafan - 53 25. Murieleirum - 46 26. Yaminoqueen - 36 27. layli gilpatrick - 33 28. Altie - 32 29 mafura Ra - 31 30 Moria Polonius - 29 31 Saya - 29 32. norwhite Zhao - 25 33 GinaBright - 24 34 sublimeskating, kaerb - 22 35. Aoto Shiro - 17 36. Syless Jinx - 15 37. Maja Hled - 13 38. axelnojutsu - 11 39. robin - 7 It's so close in so many places! Top 10s for the single disciplines in spoiler tag, to make the post not too long: Anyone better in the disciplines she/he watches the least then her/his favorite ones? Would look that way, given that Pairs and Dance gave us more points then Men & Ladies. Even the points to get into the top 10 at all in those disciplines are higher then the top spot ones from the single disciplines Some more random stuff: The event we did best in overall is Skate Canada, Internationaux de France was the worst one. As for the single disciplines, the lowest average we ever had was in the SA ladies event, with only 2.43 points from 14. Next lowest being Men in IdF (3.65), Men in SC (4), Ladies in IdF (4.07) and Men in CoC (4.25). The best one was Ice Dance in SC - by far! - with an average of 12.62. Next 2 highest are in Ice Dance too, at CoC (9.87) and NHK (9.14). Guess the trends are very obvious I will post the questions for the GPF next weekend. Since it's the last round and the ~grand finale~ (even though it doesn't feel that way I guess ^^"), I'd like to raise the stakes a bit: first, guessing all the placements, not just the top 3. It's only 6 participants anyway, so you'd basically have to answer 3 more questions with who is 4th, 5th & 6th. The point system for the podium would be the same, you'd get 2 points for guessing the 3 lower placements right. I'd also like to include more bonus questions (though at this point there will be some repetitions from earlier GPs coming in, because I'm running out of ideas ), maybe 3 per discipline instead of only one. I'd keep the points the same though instead of applying a factor, like GPF points count double. Everybody fine with that, or do you want something else? If not, speak now or forever hold your peace

Hamada really keeps getting dragged for those words everywhere ^^" IIRC, Marin herself admitted that she doesn't like to train, so I'm not too sure what Hamada said is so different. Brian pretty much said similar things about Javi too. Ofc it might not be the best thing to say out loud, but it IMO depends on the coach student relationship and how openly they talk about things with each other and all. And we know nothing about that. For all we know, Hamada might have said that to Marin for months and tried to get her to focus more on practice, and it didn't work. Also, Hamada has - completely rightfully IMO - called out the media for hyping Main too much. We gotta remember that with Marin, there is the whole PR company/child idol stuff happening too. I couldn't blame Hamada if she was not exactly happy with that.

Dunno, at this point in time tbh I wouldn't be surprised if the young hungry, challenging, super awesome quad jumpers won't be going for their new quads at the Olys, while old granddaddy fossil Yuzu will. Can't lie, that would crack me up, given the narrative the media has been trying to push there. It's a smart choice for Nathan though to not include the 4Lo. He doesn't need it when he can repeat the 4Lz, and he can gain more out of focusing on choreo/performance too IMO. And I also have to admit I'm too worried for his hip when he does it. Good to know he plans to stay another 4 years, I'd love to see him stick around and develop.

That was my thought since I saw his new programs. There is still room to grow, and I really don't agree with his scores, but the programs are good, play to his strengths while hiding his weaknesses, and he obviously enjoys skating them. It's always hard to say how the Olys will go though, Nathan has good nerves in general, but Olys are something else... I hope he isn't peaking to early or ends up giving his best at the team event (given that USA are going in wanting to get a medal, I'd think he'll have to take part in the team event in some form). And he does have the advantage of being healthy (and please stay healthy ._.) - Yuzu has the ankle injury, Boyang has an ankle injury (right foot too), Shoma has one according to injuries and had that nasty flu before IdF, Patrick still struggles with coming back from injuries and motivation, Javi had that food poisoning... this damned season

That is always easy to say though She probably thought it wasn't too serious, and I'm not sure I even want to know how many "smaller" things athletes have to go through quite regularly. So maybe it didn't appear as any reason for concern to her at first. But it is worrying at this point that the injury has troubled her for so long and has even gotten worse. Hopefully, hopefully she'll make the right choice for her, whichever that is, and be able to heal completely as soon as possible. If she's not ready by GPF, and that seems scarily likely given it is only 3 weeks, I hope she WDs and focuses on the next competition (likely RN). I mean, maybe she can organize a little GPF viewing party with Yuzu, Javi, Chiddy, Gabby, Mai and all the other potentially missing skaters people would have thought were locks for the final (or at least close to it) before. Or they do an anti-GPF thing, and either skate together in a fun competition without jumps somewhere, or make a video evening, or... eh, something. Seriously, GPF this year will feel so weird...

Prediction round for the last regular GP event is out - link here: https://www.flexiquiz.com/SC/N/ce8614ff-3b76-47c1-921d-a2e723374684 As always good luck to everyone

There is also this analysis by the Skating Protocol: https://www.instagram.com/p/BahHfJIBQzO/?hl=en&taken-by=skatingprotocol It's the direct scores every single judge gave, without averaging. Ms. Azuma scored most of them higher then average, but what sticks out is that she had Nathan winning the FS over Yuzu - by a bigger margin then the US judge even

Regarding the whole "crossovers count for transition" thing Mr. Wong started - I don't think it's worth trying to understand what the skating/PCS related reasoning for that statement could be. He works for USFSA (IceNetwork is owned by them), USFSAs top skaters get often criticized for too many crossovers (now most importantly Nathan, but Ashley too for example), end of it. Because by all accounts, while crossovers do count as transitions - as per definition everything that a skater does between technical elements does - it's completely weird to highlight them the way he did. It makes no sense in any way. And @yuzuangel, thanks for the interesting charts! Amazing how clearly Ms. Azuma from CoR left her mark That amazing Judge who gave Nathan a higher TR score then Yuzuru in the LP (9.5 to 9.25)

Happy Birthday Zhenya! Dima wished her a happy bday too, and look at his included picture

Yep, ehm... it holds a special place in my heart too

So, well, uhm.... how do I start this? Let's say we weren't all thaaaaaat successful this week... let's say our points look pretty much as if we were a Japanese ladies skater, judged by the ISU. But I guess that makes sense, because looking at that cursed GP, I think we're representing it perfectly? Anyway, of course there are winners - and for the IdF prediction round, those are: 1. freeyafanfan - 30 points 2. Crazykuroneko, Fay, YuzuPon - 26 points 3. novana, SallyCinnamon - 25 points As for the single disciplines: YuzuPon won the men, with 12 points, followed by Sayu93 & singcarcom with 9. In ladies, the highest point total was 7 points, by YT, novana and Sally. Pairs had exactly one perfect 14, by Crazykuroneko. She's followed by Murieleirum with 12. And in Dance, we have 1 perfect 14 again, by freeyafanfan - which is majorly responsible for her IdF win, given that the next highest point total achieved is 8, so quite the difference! Congrats to all the winners here! As for the answers to the bonus question: Men - will we have at least one medalist who didn't land any clean quad? Yes, we did, Misha (who was lovely!) Ladies - will we see more calls for lutz or flip edges, or none/equal number? The answer is flip, since we had the amazing amount of... 1 call overall. It was a ! for Yunas 3F in the LP. Pairs - will the 3rd podium Pair manage to beat J/C or T/M in at least one of SP or LP? No, they did not. T/M & J/C occupied the first 2 placements in both segments. Dance - will P/C get a new WR? They did, in FD & overall. Last part - the overall leaders so far after 5 out of 7 events. Men: 1. Sayu93 (26 p), 2. LilSailor (25 p), 3. YuzuPon (22 p) Ladies: 1. Yata (40 p), 2. Singcarcom (39 p), Joey (37 p) Pairs: 1. Crazykuroneko (52 p), kitsune & ralucutzagy (48 p), Joey (47 p) Dance: 1. golden & Yata (58 p), Lily (54 p), xeyra & Joey (52 p) Overall, showing the leaders with 140+ so far: 1. Yata - 151 points 2. Joey - 148 3. kitsune - 143 4. Kelly - 142 5. ralucutzagy, Sally - 141 6. Xeyra - 140 And again, thank you everyone for participating. I'll probably get the SA round out on monday as usual

I'd rather say both are very inconsistent in general, and especially Gabby still seems to need time to come back from her surgery in the off-season. Plus, we are still at the beginning of the season ^^" Also, Ashley is the only hope the US has left for a lady at the final. I wouldn't underestimate that. If they just decide to turn a blind eye to her technical problems, her scores could be huge. And Polina would need to skate worse then at NHK or be even more underscored (she was very underscored there IMO). Her score from NHK was higher then Karens PB anyway, and Gabby has only scored higher once IIRC, WC last season.

How can Polina not score above 212? And how will Ashley not be hard to beat? Yes, technically Wakaba still has a chance, but come on... it's super unlikely. Edit: And why does Polina need a 212? To have a higher combined total then Wakaba, she needs a 209+ in SA, slightly lower then her NHK score.

Oh geez, I'm so sorry, I misread that Can I claim partial mental incapacity because of anger at ridiculous judging? Regarding 4Lz this season or not - I think the original plan was: 3 quads in LP in 2014-15, 4Lo in 2015-16, 4Lz in 2016-17. We know he started of like that in 2014, and had been training 4Lo & 4Lz for a long time. So he could have stayed with a trusted layout for the Oly season. But the damn accident put a stop to those plans. The way it is... not sure what he would have done with sane scoring. He loves challenges, so maybe he would have anyway.

Everyone who has twitter and wants to send Waka some words of support after her likely end of GPF chances, she tweeted something here. It's not a lot, but maybe a bit of love from skating fans can cheer her up, and there are already 50 comments to it