General Skating Chat

[Forcefield]

4 minutes ago, xeyra said:

Javi: I'm happy about my bronze medal!

Also Javi: Will continue to talk about how Shoma was a bit overscored and he might have gotten silver otherwise.

To be fair to him, Spanish media keeps bringing it up.

 

Thing is, Javi actually had the highest GOEs of the FS (17.41 to Yuzu's 16.99 and Shoma's 7.87; Nathan had 12.53) but his BV was almost 20 points below Shoma's because of the pop. So that made a big difference.

 

If Spanish media keeps asking, it could mean they're actually much saltier than Javi is about the medal color.

 

Hopefully with how hung up they are they go on to give Javi's career and figure skating in Spain much more attention after this so they can start lobbying more for their skaters and Javi can coach skaters to success much easier.

[Elaine]

8 minutes ago, xeyra said:

Javi: I'm happy about my bronze medal!

Also Javi: Will continue to talk about how Shoma was a bit overscored and he might have gotten silver otherwise.

To be fair to him, Spanish media keeps bringing it up.

 

Thing is, Javi actually had the highest GOEs of the FS (17.41 to Yuzu's 16.99 and Shoma's 7.87; Nathan had 12.53) but his BV was almost 20 points below Shoma's because of the pop. So that made a big difference.

 

Cant blame him for thinking of that; the margin was so small that it can totally be controlled, which sounds bad but reality check for FS

[meoima]

50 minutes ago, xeyra said:

Javi: I'm happy about my bronze medal!

Also Javi: Will continue to talk about how Shoma was a bit overscored and he might have gotten silver otherwise.

To be fair to him, Spanish media keeps bringing it up.

 

Thing is, Javi actually had the highest GOEs of the FS (17.41 to Yuzu's 16.99 and Shoma's 7.87; Nathan had 12.53) but his BV was almost 20 points below Shoma's because of the pop. So that made a big difference.

Shoma’s BV would be lower like around at least 5 points too if they gave correct UR and downgrade calls. The biggest difference is the tech calls.

 

But frankly, having bronze medal is said to be better than the silver for the long run, scientists say so. I don’t think Javi is bitter.  But this is a clear evidence that many skaters know when the judging is unfair. 

 

[xeyra]

Just now, meoima said:

Shoma’s BV would be lower like around at least 5 points too if they gave correct UR and downgrade calls. The biggest difference is the tech calls.

 

 

Yeah, that one was the issue, the 4Lo shoulda have been under at the very least. 

[meoima]

2 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

Yeah, that one was the issue, the 4Lo shoulda have been under at the very least. 

4lo was << and 4F <

that would make the difference.

 

[xeyra]

26 minutes ago, meoima said:

4lo was << and 4F <

that would make the difference.

 

 

Even just a 4Lo< would, since it would lower Shoma's BV by 3.6 points, which is more than the difference between their totals.

[meoima]

20 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

Even just a 4Lo< would, since it would lower Shoma's BV by 3.6 points, which is more than the difference between their totals.

Yes but << for 4Lo and < for 4F were more correct.

[Dara]

Speaking of Shoma's Oly scoring and tech calls. I read one Japanese blog today and that blogger pointed out that Shoma's FCCoSp should be not counted at all or at least (as technical panel was soft on other skaters too) called FCCoSp3V instead of level 4. Apparently his camel position as well as upright position lacks 2 full rotations - and a spin with no basic position with 2 revs should receive no level and no points.

I can't find Shoma's FS video (taken down, urgh) to check this, but if it's right...

[yuzuangel]

3 hours ago, ICeleste said:

Wow... Javi is   about his bronze

Until 0:36 he explained to casual fans why falling on a difficult jump might give you more points than executing a jump with lower BV perfectly (his tone makes it seem like he disagrees with this). He also says that doing a clean program will get you higher PCs

 

Then the interviewer asked if he thinks he deserved Silver...

Javi answered (sounding pissed): "All of Shoma's elements, especially the jumps, weren't well-.... The landings of the jumps- he lacked speed, he overrotated/stepped out ? and that should be penalized with -GOEs but the judges gave him +GOEs. He skated well, I can't deny that, he had a fall and well, I had a mistake too, so we're equal there. His other jumps should've had deductions though... Anyway, I'm happy with my medal."

 

 

3 hours ago, Forcefield said:

 

Wow Javi. I like how straightforward but gracious he is. I don't want to cry salty tears over Javi (I already do enough for Yuzu) but it does make me sad.

 

I know he took a jab at the scoring, but most importantly he made a good point and one thing I will always be glad is how Yuzu and Javi are both under TCC and will take and uphold the philosophy of quality skating with them even when they leave.

I don't think he is salty. IIRC he kept getting asked this question until he ultimately caved and answered..? Anyway, well, I think TCC is aware of Shoma's issues and (possible) overscoring, given Tracy's eloquent shade during SC and Brian and Yuzu constantly talking about technique. But none of them hold it against Shoma himself.

 

 I was very surprised the 4Lo wasn't called, because usually when Shoma falls, the jump is UR'd (and called). And that would've made the difference

[meoima]

7 minutes ago, Dara said:

Speaking of Shoma's Oly scoring and tech calls. I read one Japanese blog today and that blogger pointed out that Shoma's FCCoSp should be not counted at all or at least (as technical panel was soft on other skaters too) called FCCoSp3V instead of level 4. Apparently his camel position as well as upright position lacks 2 full rotations - and a spin with no basic position with 2 revs should receive no level and no points.

I can't find Shoma's FS video (taken down, urgh) to check this, but if it's right...

Yeap. One ISU tech specialist told me Shoma’s weakness in the camel in the summer. But... tech panel as we know... often sleep during some skater’s performance. 

[xeyra]

17 minutes ago, Dara said:

Speaking of Shoma's Oly scoring and tech calls. I read one Japanese blog today and that blogger pointed out that Shoma's FCCoSp should be not counted at all or at least (as technical panel was soft on other skaters too) called FCCoSp3V instead of level 4. Apparently his camel position as well as upright position lacks 2 full rotations - and a spin with no basic position with 2 revs should receive no level and no points.

I can't find Shoma's FS video (taken down, urgh) to check this, but if it's right...

 

You can find the full men's FS here, though not sure if geoblocked or not:

https://www.olympicchannel.com/en/playback/figure-skating-mens-free-skating/

[yuzupon]

I have to say that after Uno skated his FS, I was so relieved that he would not go above Yuzu, that I didn't even think about whether he would pass Fernandez. And then when it was confirmed that Zu has won, I was too happy to even pay attention to the fact that Uno just got silver. 

By the time I checked the protocol and saw not even < for Uno's 4Lo, I just went "And some people dare to say judges and tech panels are not on Uno's side". 

I mean, if we're truly going to scrutinize the scores, I am sure Fernandez GOEs for some of the elements could be knocked down a few in both SP and FS, too.

So, about the placing, I am rather 'eh' about it. 

 

---

Just out of curiosity, for those of you who watched the whole Men's event with commentaries (I watch without commentaries, and only watched the ones with commentaries for Zu's programs), were there any commentators that gush over Jin's 4CC win the same way they did over Fernandez' European win?

[Dara]

17 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

You can find the full men's FS here, though not sure if geoblocked or not:

https://www.olympicchannel.com/en/playback/figure-skating-mens-free-skating/

I get message about an error, probably this means it is geoblocked.

[Forcefield]

52 minutes ago, Dara said:

Speaking of Shoma's Oly scoring and tech calls. I read one Japanese blog today and that blogger pointed out that Shoma's FCCoSp should be not counted at all or at least (as technical panel was soft on other skaters too) called FCCoSp3V instead of level 4. Apparently his camel position as well as upright position lacks 2 full rotations - and a spin with no basic position with 2 revs should receive no level and no points.

I can't find Shoma's FS video (taken down, urgh) to check this, but if it's right...

 

I'm like the worst.

 

Uno's scoring wouldn't touch Hanyu's gold medal anyway and yet Hanyu's last spin in his SP...Consistency, judges. 

 

48 minutes ago, yuzuangel said:

 

I don't think he is salty. IIRC he kept getting asked this question until he ultimately caved and answered..? Anyway, well, I think TCC is aware of Shoma's issues and (possible) overscoring, given Tracy's eloquent shade during SC and Brian and Yuzu constantly talking about technique. But none of them hold it against Shoma himself.

 

 I was very surprised the 4Lo wasn't called, because usually when Shoma falls, the jump is UR'd (and called). And that would've made the difference

 

Salty is my bad on my part. For skaters like him and Hanyu, if they ever look at the protocols, maybe frustrated and confused would be a better word, though they're probably resigned after the fact too.

 

I read somewhere a while ago about some skater saying that some of them do discuss scores or something sometimes (don't bet on my memory). They know. Javi finally said something here. He knows.

 

FS is so appalling in that skaters and coaches have to know the rules inside and out to build programs and work on their issues (like Shoma and Zhenya know they have problems with some jumps even if they get away with it) and yet judges don't seem to have to either know or apply them correctly.

[xeyra]

14 minutes ago, Dara said:

I get message about an error, probably this means it is geoblocked.

 

Here's a CBC version:

Spoiler

https://streamable.com/naykb