Music talk

[PomeloPooh]

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Wow that's some amazing analysis! The analogy to literature narrative structure makes a lot of sense. For something to grab your attention and keep it for 4.5 minutes the first time you hear it, these patterns are needed. Might be why music like h&l are considered risky - when I listen to it later I recognize clear climax and low points, but the first time I heard it with the program the impression was a bit undifferentiated (tho for me it's undifferentiated beauty!).

[just_peachy]

Afterthought: Aside from technical mastery, the most compelling skates are the one where the skater embodies a character/ several characters and acts the story convincingly. R&J worked so well 'cause Yuzu BECAME both Romeo and Juliet - he embodied both characters equally, right down to Juliet's suicide by dagger :,) one might even go as far as to say he tried to inhabit the major tropes of the drama: Duty; Love; Loss. So exploring again the avenue of epic movie soundtracks for his FS could be a winner; there are so many fantastic pieces to choose from out there, and they all exist with the purpose of lending emotional expression to narrative tales about humanity (which is what the greatest movies and books explore). If he follows this thread, we will again be swept up in Yuzuru's physical eloquence :)

[dreamelena]

the50person's post is so good!!

I agree that it's important to have all those patterns.. generally Yuzu's program music choice has all those different identifiable parts. So it's not just stagnant and it's never bland. Of course, sometimes it's not that apparent the separation, so people can't appreciate it fully (coughhopenlegacycough)..

 

I wish I could have something to suggest.. but my music knowledge isn't all that good (I'm kinda ashamed because I play music haha). I'm looking forward to what will be his choice. I trust him and the team to make the best, wisest decision for the Olympic. I know it's important that the music will be able to grab people's interest directly and make them glued to his delivery and emotion. I think I agree that a dramatic long would do him good.

[Sombreuil]

I really like it when someone takes a classic- a 'warhorse' if you like- and gives it their own slant. I'm a big fan of Matthew Bourne- his Swan Lake, Cinderella, Nutcracker, Sleeping Beauty - inspired!

I don't imagine he would do R&J 3 but in an alternate universe I think Shae-lynn Bourne could do something marvellous with Prokofiev.

[Mitya]

For SP:

 

But if warhorses will be decided by Hanyu and his team "La Dance Macabre " is ok for me. Orser was skating it years ago, also Wilson put it for Kim and it was amazing! I think it'll fit Yuzuru so much and + all black toned costume, well take your heart medicine everyone!

 

Danse Macabre is my favourite classical piece like ever!!! and I agree if they have to choose a warhorse it would fit Yuzu :s_yes and I love the idea of the sparkly black costume :love: I think Saint Saens generally works with Yuzu - see the Swan

I'm not sure about the Hungarian Rhapsody altough I love it (like everyone from Hungary I think :smile )

 

The final fantasy OST could work well and is not used before, dramatic is often well received! :yes:

 

Yep, and Dance Macabre is less cliche among other warhorses. It's classic, at the mean time dynamic and there's some modern atmosphere in this piece.

 

p.s. btw your avatar pic is amazing!

[the50person]

whole post

 

 

Wow that's some amazing analysis! The analogy to literature narrative structure makes a lot of sense. For something to grab your attention and keep it for 4.5 minutes the first time you hear it, these patterns are needed. Might be why music like h&l are considered risky - when I listen to it later I recognize clear climax and low points, but the first time I heard it with the program the impression was a bit undifferentiated (tho for me it's undifferentiated beauty!).

 

Thank you! :grin:

 

I agree with you for Hope and Legacy, the structure is complicated.

 

Hope and Legacy (

and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnDv873q5zs)

 

1) PLATEAU > RISE. Music begins. Gentle running along 3 notes with its various variations. There is a slight increase in volume as he lands the 4Lo at 0:57 (he probably timed it as such).

 

2) PLATEAU. Music continues running as such, like a neverending stream, as if the 4Lo, the pebble which caused a ripple, never existed and never disturbed the ebb and flow at all.

 

3) RISE > FALL.1:09 Heavier piano notes (chords I think) begin. dun-dun-Dun-DUn-DUN as he sets up for the 4S, outright chords at 1:18 immediately before the 4S, before giving way as he leaves the ice to rotate, as if the 4S released the pressure building up, then he poses right before spin.

 

4) PLATEAU (the music is separable into layers with each spin).

Higher notes play as he enters camel spin

Strings enter midspin and he goes into donut spin

Piano re-enters and he does sit spin

As piano and string interweave he shifts and does biellman spin.

(aka any change of instruments = position/variation change)

 

5) PLATEAU > RISE. 1:44 Strings, he begins step sequence. First phase of step sequence.

 

6) RISE (HIGH PEAK). 1:56 A peak in the step sequence that attracts attention and during which he paused slightly. Interesting cos he tends to rest during the lower emotional arcs of music but in H&L he does it at peaks where its more emotional and his body (he puts his two palms facing him before opening them up and at point 10 where he grasps something) is narrating an enjoyment of music. It being a break also means those one or two seconds are drawn to his upper body, which he uses to narrate that and conduct the audience's emotions to feel whatever he is conveying.

 

7) FALL > PLATEAU. (whatever goes up comes down) 1:57 Lighter strings. Second phase of step sequence.

 

8) RISE. 2:06 Strings pause, piano melody re-enters. Third phase of step sequence. Another short pose, very very short but this serves more as a border to mark out the boundaries between the 2nd phase and 3rd phase. Heavier piano, chords introduced. Music builds. Strings re-enter.

 

9) RISE > FALL (during 3F).Music builds and builds and builds, minute pause in music before shifting to piano and he does 3F during this. Lands 3F, strings play once more.

 

10) RISE (HIGH PEAK) > RISE. Strings, music is emotional, he pauses. Longest pause ever in the program 2:49 - 2:52, also please look back at 6) for more explanation. He just feels the music.

 

11) RISE. Heavy strings, music rises and suspense builds and heavy strings go heavier and heavier with each note before giving way into strings melody (ironically as effect as climax despite being more subtle than the buildup) as the 4S3T is unleashed. This is a huge climax and even the rotations match the notes.

 

12) RISE > FALL.3:20 Strings become heavier again + heavier piano chords, music rises and suspense builds rinse repeat 11), then music ceases suddenly and bam! 4T.

 

13) PLATEAU. 3:37 Quiet music, 3A2T.

 

14) RISE. 3:50 - 4:04. Strings, music becomes more emotional, music builds up quickly, 3A1Lo3S.

 

15) FALL. Music quietens and he does his spin.

 

16) RISE, RISE, RISE. 4:21 Intense music for the choreographic sequence.

 

17) RISE (HIGH PEAK). 4:33 - 4:35, in true Yuzu style, hydroblade at important point.

 

18) RISE (or you can say PLATEAU but at a higher emotional level than previous ones). 4:36 - 4:44. Continuation of choreographic sequence. Music builds.

 

19) RISE > RISE (HIGH PEAK) 4:45 - 4:50, in true Yuzu style, ina bauer at important point.

 

20) RISE. Setup of 3Lz, the landing of the 3Lz is a highlight, 4:55 emotional music and at the same time he does camel spin.

 

21) FALL. 5:04, simple piano, he changes position while matching the drop in music.

 

22) CLOSURE. Final note gives a sense of finality and closure that exudes a dignified air befitting the theme of Legacy.

 

Tbh the ending is pretty warhorsey cos it's !intense! !dramatic! !RISE! and the old-fashioned happy ending 'I'll quiet down' closure. It's the front half that messes some people up, especially those who want things like RJ1.0 where the FALL is in the middle while H&L is rise-fall-rise-fall-rise-fall etc in the first half.

 

But we forget that this is about Hanyu Yuzuru, who's life was exactly as such.

He rose up quickly through novice, had a terrible first junior year, rose up to win everything in second junior year and debuted as senior at the ripe old age of 15, had a mediocre first senior season (cos mens field was deep in JP in those times) whereas he watched Kana shine in her debut season, had a huge FALL for 311, rose up to win bronze at first Worlds. This is the first half of the program. Then he rose to break SP WRs, rose to win Olys, fell non-stop for 14-15 season, rose for 15-16 season, fell for 16 Worlds FS, rose for 16-17 season, but whatever falls he had during his dominant years, those were, in the end, growing points for him so they were not counted as FALLs but as RISEs. Each one has served him well, like how his popping has actually made him more flexible in layout and resulted in a couple of firsts. With each season, his legend and legacy grows and evolves just like the RISEs in the second half of the program that just keep increasing with intensity without bounds. For this is a skater who knows no limits.

 

He actually has many breaks, but the breaks are very very short each time. It is interesting, because this program requires one to be the wind through the forest, the calm river and the dappled sunlight through the trees, and such small pauses make the breaks less noticeable and create the feeling of continuity. The structure of Hope and Legacy is complicated and has many highs and lows, just like that of Hanyu Yuzuru's life, and just like how it is a worthy representation of it in spirit.

 

A great person will endure great tribulations. (Someone please translate, my translation abilities have not reached such a level yet.)

故天将降大任于斯人也，必先苦其心志，劳其筋骨，饿其体肤，空乏其身，行拂乱其所为，所以动心忍性，曾益其所不能.

Something along the lines of 'When God wants to bestow a huge mission/responsibility/ etc upon someone, He will first temper your will and spirit, put you into physical trials, cause you to experience hunger, make you experience poverty, allow you to taste the bitterness of not having everything go smoothly, such that you may strengthen your heart and determination, and have renewed conviction and benefit and grow.'

[OmNom]

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Wow your analysis is so detailed :love:

I haven't watched the whole video along with the musical cues you've pointed out, but this will be great food for thought when I have some free time later. Thanks so much for your effort! :clap:

[itiahs]

Everything

Do you have a blog somewhere? I would love to read it :love:

But yeah, the structure of H&L is outside the norm for figure skating. It's like you're listening to all these pop songs and then all of a sudden, bam, a classical composer.

[xeyra]

the50person, these program music analysis are amazing. Thank you for the time you took to write them. I feel like we should archive them somewhere for posterity! Much like unico's H&L analysis back in the GS FF, which I don't think was saved in the Media Thread, sadly.

[the50person]

the50person's post is so good!!

I agree that it's important to have all those patterns.. generally Yuzu's program music choice has all those different identifiable parts. So it's not just stagnant and it's never bland. Of course, sometimes it's not that apparent the separation, so people can't appreciate it fully (coughhopenlegacycough)..

 

I wish I could have something to suggest.. but my music knowledge isn't all that good (I'm kinda ashamed because I play music haha). I'm looking forward to what will be his choice. I trust him and the team to make the best, wisest decision for the Olympic. I know it's important that the music will be able to grab people's interest directly and make them glued to his delivery and emotion. I think I agree that a dramatic long would do him good.

 

Thank you! :grin: Agree with your first paragraph.

 

Nah, your musical knowledge will be better than mine, I didn't even learn music theory so I'm sure that somewhere someone is rolling their eyes at me butchering the program with my own version of 'music analysis' :chicken:

[the50person]

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Wow your analysis is so detailed :love:

I haven't watched the whole video along with the musical cues you've pointed out, but this will be great food for thought when I have some free time later. Thanks so much for your effort! :clap:

 

You're welcome! I hope I didn't spazz too much LOL I lost control towards the end HAHAHAH

[the50person]

Everything

Do you have a blog somewhere? I would love to read it :love:

But yeah, the structure of H&L is outside the norm for figure skating. It's like you're listening to all these pop songs and then all of a sudden, bam, a classical composer.

 

Well, I'm the50-person on tumblr, I actually posted the first analysis post here (http://the50-person.tumblr.com/post/160 ... i-was-just), but I have yet to make the second one more tumblr-presentable. :grin: The thing about tumblr is that I can't (or at least, am too much of a tech idiot) change the font colours to highlight the RISE, PLATEAU and FALL, so I'll prolly bold it and put it up tomorrow.

[the50person]

the50person, these program music analysis are amazing. Thank you for the time you took to write them. I feel like we should archive them somewhere for posterity! Much like unico's H&L analysis back in the GS FF, which I don't think was saved in the Media Thread, sadly.

 

Thank you for thinking so highly of my posts. >< I really think it's not of very high quality hahahahah I know nothing about music analysis. (Heck, I don't know and can't tell the difference between genres of music) It's just a fan spazzing and somehow the whole thing went like an uncontrolled freight train and gave birth to this monster. :rotfl:

[Altie]

I've already said so in the chat thread but love these analysis :bow:

 

 

... and if Yuzu falls for Chopin once again, I would love to see him skate on

, it's my favourite...

[Aotoshiro]

Wow, I love the analysis that appeared here, most of them describe perfectly what I feel when watching H&L... :goe:

 

I've already guessed Yuzu'll use the 'bird' song for either one of the programs or for the EX, since both swans (White Legend and Notte Stellata) hold a special meaning to him, but now that I'm looking through my history on YT, I kinda want to send this one to him:

The only problem-it's too short xDD. But yeah, a warhorse is most probable, isn't it? Though I doubt Jeff will agree on it in the SP (I hope...)