General Skating Chat

[Murieleirum]

4 minutes ago, CupidsBow said:

 

I think he's capable of branching out he just went very safe. tbh I wouldn't have minded him keeping Loco but I really wish he hadn't gone back to Turandot. Other than so many others doing the same music it's just super uninteresting outside the jumps, the stsq (i guess) and the cantilever being held longer than his loco cantilever. It might grow on me as he builds on his performance of it but I've been meh about it since he announced it.

 

I find it a little off his TR score was a fraction higher than Jason's, but Jason had no quads so i guess than means he was doomed to get boned in PCS. 

 

Just a bunch of numbers:

 

on Skating skills, judges 4,5,6 (the infamous, I call them) gave to Jason Brown: 8.75, 8.75, 8.75. 

on Skating skills, the same judges 4,5,6 gave to Shoma uno:  9.50, 9.25, 9.50.

 

Evidently, they think jumping a quad is a requirement for having 'excellent skating skills'. 

 

 

 

 

[kaeryth]

Strategy Talk Time!

 

1st 2 challenger series with 2 of the top 6 men done skating.

 

Nathan: He's definitely keeping silent about his planned layout (prolly because there is no planned layout LOL). The fact that he can execute 5 different quads means he can play around with layouts and still get a high BV. They are scaling back on the quads though. And like I (and a few others) said, his team is prolly going for gradual addition of quads throughout the season to build up the PCS as the program gets emptier when the number of quads are added. Smart move because we did see the high PCS he built up last season from jumping ALL the quads culminating to Worlds went down after the failed FS at Worlds. The music choice for both the SP and FS are a much better fit and shows a bit of personality  (added bonus of not being a warhorse).

 

Shoma: From recent interviews he says he's thinking about 4S and 4Lz. He's a bit reactive in terms of strategy so I feel like we'll see some changes in layout once he's done competing with Nathan at Japan Open - depending on what Nathan's layout is gonna be. /LOL/

[xeyra]

Yuzu: Does 3 quads in the second half

Shoma: Does 3 quads in the second half

Nathan: Hold my orange juice...

[Murieleirum]

3 minutes ago, kaeryth said:

Shoma: From recent interviews he says he's thinking about 4S and 4Lz. He's a bit reactive in terms of strategy so I feel like we'll see some changes in layout once he's done competing with Nathan at Japan Open - depending on what Nathan's layout is gonna be. /LOL/

 

I think Lombardia has taught Shoma that he doesn't need the 4Lz to play his cards to win all the winnable stuff. 

[meoima]

2 minutes ago, kaeryth said:

Strategy Talk Time!

 

1st 2 challenger series with 2 of the top 6 men done skating.

 

Nathan: He's definitely keeping silent about his planned layout (prolly because there is no planned layout LOL). The fact that he can execute 5 different quads means he can play around with layouts and still get a high BV. They are scaling back on the quads though. And like I (and a few others) said, his team is prolly going for gradual addition of quads throughout the season to build up the PCS as the program gets emptier when the number of quads are added. Smart move because we did see the high PCS he built up last season from jumping ALL the quads culminating to Worlds went down after the failed FS at Worlds. The music choice for both the SP and FS are a much better fit and shows a bit of personality  (added bonus of not being a warhorse).

 

Shoma: From recent interviews he says he's thinking about 4S and 4Lz. He's a bit of reactive in terms of strategy so I feel like we'll see some changes in layout once he's done competing with Nathan at Japan Open - depending on what Nathan's layout is gonna be. /LOL/

Nathan will not care to win Japan Open, because it's Japan Open, sorry it's a fake competition. Skaters come there to get the money and test the feelings of their programs. I am not shocked if Nathan goes to Japan Open and only does 3-4 quads. 

Nathan's strategy I think is much wiser in this case. He debuts the program first, get good impression and good PCS first. And he will add more quads as he feels healthy. Judges will never give much lower PCS than they gave it in the past.

Aslo, Nathan's team is trying to make him not to peak too early by adding too many things all at once.

if I have to bet between Shoma and Nathan, who will place higher at Olympic, I will bet on Nathan. 

[xeyra]

5 minutes ago, Murieleirum said:

 

I think Lombardia has taught Shoma that he doesn't need the 4Lz to play his cards to win all the winnable stuff. 

 

On the contrary, actually. I'm not sure if this hasn't spurred 4Lz even more.

[Murieleirum]

Just now, xeyra said:

 

On the contrary, actually. I'm not sure if this hasn't spurred 4Lz even more.

 

But Shoma knows he can do a lot better than today, with the same tech. His GOE's were average, not really high and not really low, but he can gain a good +10 on TES overall if he lands everything perfectly (which is hard though, since typical Shoma landing isn't perfect by nomenclature) and can gain +5 points on PCS; which would allow him to break Yuzuru's world records in GPF 2015. It's not easy, but it's in sight. Judges are giving him the possibility, they're kinda saying 'yeah, we'll make you get there, just keep up the cleanliness'. So adding a jump that he can't do (from what we've seen so far) is counterproductive, imo... 

[kaeryth]

7 minutes ago, Murieleirum said:

 

I think Lombardia has taught Shoma that he doesn't need the 4Lz to play his cards to win all the winnable stuff. 

 

2 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

On the contrary, actually. I'm not sure if this hasn't spurred 4Lz even more.

 

Agreed with @xeyra. I'm sorry to say that this wasn't really a challenging competition for Shoma. Everyone knew he was gonna be 1st it's just a matter of the score... and the score showed that he still couldn't beat Yuzu's scores with his 5quad program. So that 4Lz is looking mighty tempting now... and, he surely knows Yuzu has a 4Lz hiding somewhere as well. /LOL/

[Katt]

I found its interesting to think about these strategies.

 

Nathan has good programs and he add quads as the season goes, considering he had 5 type of quads, he has plenty of options. I think the same, that he want to give good impression to judges at the first outing and then his PCS will rise if he stay on his feet when he add quads left and right. 

 

Yuzuru/Shoma reuse/do the program they're comfortable with, which its expect good pcs right at the beginning with near full layout. If they're consistent, their score will rise too. 

 

Different approach and both sounds good. Cant say which one is better    

[xeyra]

2 minutes ago, Murieleirum said:

 

But Shoma knows he can do a lot better than today, with the same tech. His GOE's were average, not really high and not really low, but he can gain a good +10 on TES overall if he lands everything perfectly (which is hard though, since typical Shoma landing isn't perfect by nomenclature) and can gain +5 points on PCS; which would allow him to break Yuzuru's world records in GPF 2015. It's not easy, but it's in sight. Judges are giving him the possibility, they're kinda saying 'yeah, we'll make you get there, just keep up the cleanliness'. So adding a jump that he can't do (from what we've seen so far) is counterproductive, imo... 

 

He got about three total GOE less here than he did at Worlds. Yeah, he can improve on it and on his PCS too. Work in progress for the season. 

[Murieleirum]

Just now, kaeryth said:

 

 

Agreed with @xeyra. I'm sorry to say that this wasn't really a challenging competition for Shoma. Everyone knew he was gonna be 1st it's just a matter of the score... and the score showed that he still couldn't beat Yuzu's scores with his 5quad program. So that 4Lz is looking mighty tempting now... and, he surely knows Yuzu has a 4Lz hiding somewhere as well. /LOL/

 

Adding 4Lz to go over Yuzuru's scores with a 6 quads program is like saying 'I will never do a perfect performance and with the same quality of Yuzuru, so I have to resort to quad party'. I'm not sure Shoma is so ready to accept that mindset, but I don't know him well, so I wouldn't know. 

And of course he can't beat Yuzu's scores yet. It's still September! 

[xeyra]

3 minutes ago, Katt said:

I found its interesting to think about these strategies.

 

Nathan has good programs and he add quads as the season goes, considering he had 5 type of quads, he has plenty of options. I think the same, that he want to give good impression to judges at the first outing and then his PCS will rise if he stay on his feet when he add quads left and right. 

 

Yuzuru/Shoma reuse/do the program they're comfortable with, which its expect good pcs right at the beginning with near full layout. If they're consistent, their score will rise too. 

 

Different approach and both sounds good. Cant say which one is better    

 

If Nathan lands 7 quads by the end... maybe his. 

 

1 minute ago, Murieleirum said:

 

Adding 4Lz to go over Yuzuru's scores with a 6 quads program is like saying 'I will never do a perfect performance and with the same quality of Yuzuru, so I have to resort to quad party'. I'm not sure Shoma is so ready to accept that mindset, but I don't know him well, so I wouldn't know. 

And of course he can't beat Yuzu's scores yet. It's still September! 

 

Well, doesn't need to be the 4Lz too but 4Lz instead. My feeling is he'll go for the 4Lz at Japan Open. 

[Katt]

2 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

If Nathan lands 7 quads by the end... maybe his. 

 

My hip hurts just to think about it 

[kaeryth]

I don't trust whatever strategy Yuzu is spewing out right now though. I'm still shaking my fist at that FS layout with just one 3A /LOL/

[Murieleirum]

9 minutes ago, xeyra said:

Well, doesn't need to be the 4Lz too but 4Lz instead. My feeling is he'll go for the 4Lz at Japan Open. 

 

Instead of...?

The Salchow is nice and gives him no edge issue. Instead of the Loop? Today it was wobbly, but he has a good Loop too. 4T is his most stable quad.