Costumes talk

[kaeryth]

3 hours ago, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

So I was looking through the portfolio of the designer Hanyu has been going through these past few years to get his costumes made and wow, she's incredible with details. It's no wonder Hanyu and so many others go to her. Strange thing is, even though I see a bunch of other skaters in her portfolio, there's zero mention of Hanyu himself. Like, if they hadn't released that news about his SEIMEI costume last month, you wouldn't even have known that he hires her services. I'm guessing there's a  good reason but man, the complete lack is more stark than if at least one of his costumes she's made for him gets featured, especially since that recent news made the front page of the sports section. 

 

I think it's probably because his costumes are more of mainly his ideas/design rather than hers? So even if it might be a collaborative effort, she might not be comfortable advertising the costumes as hers alone (that's my theory anyway). I mean if you take a look at just Semei and Chopin, their designs are aesthetically different from most of her pieces. The only costume of Yuzu's I could think of that matches the rest of her portfolio is Notte Stellata - in which we could see similar details with Shoma's Winter.

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

3 時間前, kaerythさんが言いました:

 

I think it's probably because his costumes are more of mainly his ideas/design rather than hers? So even if it might be a collaborative effort, she might not be comfortable advertising the costumes as hers alone (that's my theory anyway). I mean if you take a look at just Semei and Chopin, their designs are aesthetically different from most of her pieces. The only costume of Yuzu's I could think of that matches the rest of her portfolio is Notte Stellata - in which we could see similar details with Shoma's Winter.

 

Yeah but based on that article, it seems to indicate POTO 2.0, at least, was all her, given that he needed it done in a hurry (she apparently had to start work on it the very night the accident happened was it? Or damn near close to it) and prolly didn't have the time to dither around and stamp himself all over it (tho she still managed to come out still something that seemed like he did anyway). And yeah, I dunno how much of NS was his idea. The basic idea has gotta be from her at least cos I can't imagine him coming up with that on his own without some kind of obvious base to copy off of inspiration. The bit with the feathers is very likely him tho.

[kaeryth]

13 minutes ago, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

 

Yeah but based on that article, it seems to indicate POTO 2.0, at least, was all her, given that he needed it done in a hurry (she apparently had to start work on it the very night the accident happened was it? Or damn near close to it) and prolly didn't have the time to dither around and stamp himself all over it (tho she still managed to come out still something that seemed like he did anyway). And yeah, I dunno how much of NS was his idea. The basic idea has gotta be from her at least cos I can't imagine him coming up with that on his own without some kind of obvious base to copy off of inspiration. The bit with the feathers is very likely him tho.

 

RE: POTO 2. - I feel that while she has her own trademark design/aesthetic, she also knows enough about Yuzu's to make a costume that satisfies his requirements. This is just based on looking at all the costumes she displays in her portfolio. Most of the pieces have something that ties them together (intricate designs and beadworks) but Yuzu's costumes doesn't really 'fit' with any of them.

[SparkleSalad]

12 minutes ago, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

 

Yeah but based on that article, it seems to indicate POTO 2.0, at least, was all her, given that he needed it done in a hurry (she apparently had to start work on it the very night the accident happened was it? Or damn near close to it) and prolly didn't have the time to dither around and stamp himself all over it (tho she still managed to come out still something that seemed like he did anyway). And yeah, I dunno how much of NS was his idea. The basic idea has gotta be from her at least cos I can't imagine him coming up with that on his own without some kind of obvious base to copy off of inspiration. The bit with the feathers is very likely him tho.

 

Well in his defense, Johnny's hand-puppet swan really wasn't beautiful enough for Notte Stellata, though it is similar to his City of Angels costume.

 

 

 

 

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

1 時間前, SparkleSaladさんが言いました:

 

Well in his defense, Johnny's hand-puppet swan really wasn't beautiful enough for Notte Stellata, though it is similar to his City of Angels costume.

 

 

 

 

Oh hey, yeah this looks like it could be where NS was lifted from. Hanyu's pickiness and Ito's eye for detail really turn these costumes which basic designs are all borrowed into something much more incredible than their originals. Must be something that comes with being Extra...

 

1 時間前, kaerythさんが言いました:

 

RE: POTO 2. - I feel that while she has her own trademark design/aesthetic, she also knows enough about Yuzu's to make a costume that satisfies his requirements. This is just based on looking at all the costumes she displays in her portfolio. Most of the pieces have something that ties them together (intricate designs and beadworks) but Yuzu's costumes doesn't really 'fit' with any of them.

Well, his stuff all have this in abundance as well. In fact, I think he goes to her precisely because of her ability to weave intricate details into her creations. But I guess I can see where you're coming from in terms of overall cut and style. For the males, especially. Hino's and Uno's ones all seem to have some kind of overt similarity. Hanyu's pOto 2.0 has a passing one at best. Still, even if it's different, unless explicitly denied permission to, wouldn't you want to put it up for the world to see? Because it shows her versatility as a designer, and adaptability. And besides, what sane designer would voluntarily pass up on the chance as having Hanyu as a model? 

[SparkleSalad]

Lol, the website says "don't bring us designs from other designers."  I wonder if it's not more of a not wanting to take credit for Johnny Weir's work rather than being Hanyu's "assistant." She was probably quite pleased to have to design a new POTO costume because even the first one was a mishmash of two or three of Johnny's. She did such an unbelievable job. It's a masterpiece. 

[kaeryth]

41 minutes ago, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

Well, his stuff all have this in abundance as well. In fact, I think he goes to her precisely because of her ability to weave intricate details into her creations. But I guess I can see where you're coming from in terms of overall cut and style. For the males, especially. Hino's and Uno's ones all seem to have some kind of overt similarity. Hanyu's pOto 2.0 has a passing one at best. Still, even if it's different, unless explicitly denied permission to, wouldn't you want to put it up for the world to see? Because it shows her versatility as a designer, and adaptability. And besides, what sane designer would voluntarily pass on having Hanyu as a model? 

 

15 minutes ago, SparkleSalad said:

Lol, the website says "don't bring us designs from other designers."  I wonder if it's not more of a not wanting to take credit for Johnny Weir's work rather than being Hanyu's "assistant." She was probably quite pleased to have to design a new POTO costume because even the first one was a mishmash of two or three of Johnny's. She did such an unbelievable job. It's a masterpiece. 

 

That's probably it. It's her work but it's not her original idea/design so she might not feel comfortable putting it out as her body of work. Reading the translation of her design for Shoma's Turandot vs Yuzu's Seimei is very telling. In the end, most people still know that she made his costume so she still gets the publicity.

[SparkleSalad]

1 minute ago, kaeryth said:

 

 

That's probably it. It's her work but it's not her original idea/design so she might not feel comfortable putting it out as her body of work. Reading the translation of her design for Shoma's Turandot vs Yuzu's Seimei is very telling. In the end, most people still know that she made his costume so she still gets the publicity.

 

I wonder what SEIMEI would have looked like had Johnny done a Heian period piece first.  Fanartists, do your thing!

[getsurenka]

15 minutes ago, kaeryth said:

 

 

That's probably it. It's her work but it's not her original idea/design so she might not feel comfortable putting it out as her body of work. Reading the translation of her design for Shoma's Turandot vs Yuzu's Seimei is very telling. In the end, most people still know that she made his costume so she still gets the publicity.

It's interesting how the two articles on the costumes designing process speak bounds about the skaters' personalities too.

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

25 分, kaerythさんが言いました:

 

 

That's probably it. It's her work but it's not her original idea/design so she might not feel comfortable putting it out as her body of work. Reading the translation of her design for Shoma's Turandot vs Yuzu's Seimei is very telling. In the end, most people still know that she made his costume so she still gets the publicity.

 

45 分, SparkleSaladさんが言いました:

Lol, the website says "don't bring us designs from other designers."  I wonder if it's not more of a not wanting to take credit for Johnny Weir's work rather than being Hanyu's "assistant." She was probably quite pleased to have to design a new POTO costume because even the first one was a mishmash of two or three of Johnny's. She did such an unbelievable job. It's a masterpiece. 

Ah, that explains things some. Maybe she agreed to accept Hanyu's commission because, well it's Hanyu, and even without his clout, I imagine he's the sort you just don't have the heart to turn down. Even if it wasn't exactly bringing her someone else's design, if she turned him away, it'd be like a hairdresser telling a bright-eyed kid no when the kid brings them a picture of *insert celebrity with great hair* and told them they wanted that same haircut.

 

Okay, it's probably more because he presents a different sort of challenge for her in mashing recycled ideas strong inspiration with original details and the whole thing being a collaborative endeavor with the skater himself as opposed to being completely entrusted to handle everything but...there's gotta be at least some of the hairdresser scenario, at least in the beginning.

 

Or, I'm not sure how long she's been doing this for skaters but Hanyu has been a client for at least since 2014 so he could very well be one of her very first ones when she was less picky about whether or not she gets to handle the design fully...

[getsurenka]

11 minutes ago, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

Or, I'm not sure how long she's been doing this for skaters but Hanyu has been a client for at least since 2014 so he could very well be one of her very first ones when she was less picky about whether or not she gets to handle the design fully...

I really hope someday there will be an interview/article that explains more on how Yuzuru came to work with her, and more on how his costumes came about. With Seimei, it seems like Yuzuru had a specific image on how he wanted the costume to look like, but what about the other costumes? I love to know more about the original Chopin costume, and the re-editions of it. Did he also have an image of how Chopin costume is like, or was she the one who proposed the design of it? (I love them very much, esp the first edition).

 

Questions that probably will never get answered... 

[axelsandwich]

Yeah, the lack of Yuzu's costumes in her portfolio also struck me as a bit weird because like... from any sort of marketing perspective, he's a pretty big coup of a client, why wouldn't you at least put his name up? Most likely reason is probably a combination of what people pointed out earlier (Yuzu's design not being 100% her vision, unlike Shoma's -- even Notte Stellata, I'm sure he had a set of detailed ideas and references; someone pointed out Chopin was also probably inspired by Johnny) and Yuzu's costumes are definitely not 'her' usual style. You don't usually want a designer describing themselves as a seamstress/assistant LOL

 

I get commissioned to make art on occasion but I know I'm always much more enthusiastic about displaying my own conceptual work and Shoma's basically a blank cheque for her creative freedom. From the news coverage, she's designing basically all the single skaters' costumes (or at least a huge number) so it's not like she's lacking work at the moment, or is potentially so busy she doesn't have time to update her website which is also not unusual. Or she's just not a huge fan lol.

[SparkleSalad]

1 minute ago, getsurenka said:

I really hope someday there will be an interview/article that explains more on how Yuzuru came to work with her, and more on how his costumes came about. With Seimei, it seems like Yuzuru had a specific image on how he wanted the costume to look like, but what about the other costumes? I love to know more about the original Chopin costume, and the re-editions of it. Did he also have an image of how Chopin costume is like, or was she the one who proposed the design of it? (I love them very much, esp the first edition).

 

Chopin belongs to Johnny, too.

 

On 11/25/2017 at 8:02 PM, SparkleSalad said:

 

Not designed but inspired by, for sure. 

 

 

(This one is very painful to watch.)

 

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

15 分, getsurenkaさんが言いました:

I really hope someday there will be an interview/article that explains more on how Yuzuru came to work with her, and more on how his costumes came about. With Seimei, it seems like Yuzuru had a specific image on how he wanted the costume to look like, but what about the other costumes? I love to know more about the original Chopin costume, and the re-editions of it. Did he also have an image of how Chopin costume is like, or was she the one who proposed the design of it? (I love them very much, esp the first edition).

 

Questions that probably will never get answered... 

At this point, I think a good 60-70%of his costumes, including Chopin, is Weir-inspired, even today. And quite unapologetically, too. >_<  That, or it's flat-out Weir-designed. You really can't get a more obvious and dedicated fanboy than in Hanyu.

 

Also, their builds are pretty similar which I think why he found the designs so appealing but because he's even more svelte and has a smaller waistline, together with the changes for the better, the designs look better on him than they ever did on Weir.

 

I know H&L is probably Etude 2.0 but is there an obvious inspiration for Etude itself?

[SparkleSalad]

4 minutes ago, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

At this point, I think a good 60% of his costumes, including Chopin, is Weir-inspired, even today. And quite unapologetically, too. >_< Their build is pretty similar which I think why he found the designs so appealing but because he's even more svelte and has a smaller waistline, together with the changes for the better, the designs look better on him than they ever did on weir.

 

I know H&L is probably Etude 2.0 but is there an obvious inspiration for Etude itself?

 

source

 

ETA I think you're underestimating Johnny's influence. I'd put it closer to 90%.

 

Sota Yamamoto also borrowed it (and a few other Japanese skaters but can't remember right now.)

source