2019–20 Coronavirus Pandemic (COVID-19) Thread

[Sombreuil]

I’m feeling ground down too.  We’ve been out a bit, but social distancing, masks and visors, etc rather take the fun out of eating out etc and watching people draping their masks round their necks and not following one way markings is irritating.   My elderly relatives are showing definite signs of deterioration after so many months of isolation - I’m sure some of it is just natural progression but some of it is due to lack of stimulation.  
 

Media here are talking about ‘long Covid’ - people who in many cases weren’t bad enough for hospital but had a bad bout at home, appeared to be recovering and are now having post Covid problems that aren’t being taken seriously across the whole health system especially where there was no test done so no proof the person had it.  Depressing to think how inaccurate all these figures being bandied about probably are. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54031587

[SitTwizzle]

3 hours ago, Sombreuil said:

I’m feeling ground down too.  We’ve been out a bit, but social distancing, masks and visors, etc rather take the fun out of eating out etc and watching people draping their masks round their necks and not following one way markings is irritating.   My elderly relatives are showing definite signs of deterioration after so many months of isolation - I’m sure some of it is just natural progression but some of it is due to lack of stimulation.  
 

Media here are talking about ‘long Covid’ - people who in many cases weren’t bad enough for hospital but had a bad bout at home, appeared to be recovering and are now having post Covid problems that aren’t being taken seriously across the whole health system especially where there was no test done so no proof the person had it.  Depressing to think how inaccurate all these figures being bandied about probably are. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54031587

About symptoms not being taken seriously, I have no doubt of the frequency of the problem, in UK even more than elsewhere (and I tend to see in "unattendance" the major cause for the CoViD death toll in UK in spite of massive tests; I have lived in England and it took me many many months to be merely registered at a GP just in case I would be sent some day in a hospital, never seen a doctor of course; and when I got injured, not severely fortunately, I went to friends' who were nurses and who cleaned the wound and bandaged me as they could, I know I was much better off than in any public A&E).

But I have read on worldometers.info/coronavirus that UK had had massive tests from the beginning of the epidemic there, so if people with symptoms were not tested, I don't understand how tests were prioritised.

 

One site with accurate numbers I believe, but this is just the excess death rate so from all causes (for instance, every summer in Spain and Portugal there are small increases during a week or two, it is likelier to be heat waves like other years, than CoViD), not reflecting exactly the contamination numbers (because if contaminated people are younger as it was lately, they are less likely to die, for instance) and reflecting it late (there are often many weeks between a contamination and a death). In every country of the panel it is counted the same way, which I find very useful. You may be able to see how did England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland during the epidemic, and compare it with neighbouring countries. It is euromomo.eu (an European Union research institution).

[Figure_Frenzy]

I trust that everyone who posts on this thread knows the benefits of wearing a mask, but just in case you still need to convince someone, you can show them this↓

 

[rockstaryuzu]

17 hours ago, Sombreuil said:

Media here are talking about ‘long Covid’ - people who in many cases weren’t bad enough for hospital but had a bad bout at home, appeared to be recovering and are now having post Covid problems that aren’t being taken seriously across the whole health system especially where there was no test done so no proof the person had it.

We've had some long-haulers here too. One guy in particular has made the news because he's been testing positive since March and his symptoms are basically random, but debillitating. The hospital I work at is trying their best for him and others like him but it's really a question of what do you even do, when you don't have a handle on what's going on?

[Sombreuil]

On 9/8/2020 at 2:13 PM, SitTwizzle said:

About symptoms not being taken seriously, I have no doubt of the frequency of the problem, in UK even more than elsewhere (and I tend to see in "unattendance" the major cause for the CoViD death toll in UK in spite of massive tests; I have lived in England and it took me many many months to be merely registered at a GP just in case I would be sent some day in a hospital, never seen a doctor of course; and when I got injured, not severely fortunately, I went to friends' who were nurses and who cleaned the wound and bandaged me as they could, I know I was much better off than in any public A&E).

But I have read on worldometers.info/coronavirus that UK had had massive tests from the beginning of the epidemic there, so if people with symptoms were not tested, I don't understand how tests were prioritised.

 

One site with accurate numbers I believe, but this is just the excess death rate so from all causes (for instance, every summer in Spain and Portugal there are small increases during a week or two, it is likelier to be heat waves like other years, than CoViD), not reflecting exactly the contamination numbers (because if contaminated people are younger as it was lately, they are less likely to die, for instance) and reflecting it late (there are often many weeks between a contamination and a death). In every country of the panel it is counted the same way, which I find very useful. You may be able to see how did England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland during the epidemic, and compare it with neighbouring countries. It is euromomo.eu (an European Union research institution).

The only testing in March was in hospitals- if you had symptoms you were told to self quarantine, no one tested to see if you had Covid or an ordinary cold, no one tested old people in homes, or staff.  I have an acquaintance whose husband was ill in early March,  he shrugged it off and appeared fine, but one of their children who is a hospital worker got tested positive- the mother then became ill and they wondered about the fathers illness earlier.  The parents, both previously fit and well, have persistent respiratory problems still dragging on.

[SitTwizzle]

2 hours ago, Sombreuil said:

The only testing in March was in hospitals- if you had symptoms you were told to self quarantine, no one tested to see if you had Covid or an ordinary cold, no one tested old people in homes, or staff.  I have an acquaintance whose husband was ill in early March,  he shrugged it off and appeared fine, but one of their children who is a hospital worker got tested positive- the mother then became ill and they wondered about the fathers illness earlier.  The parents, both previously fit and well, have persistent respiratory problems still dragging on.

In March we did worse, testing-wise. Including friends and relatives.

I meant now.

[barbara]

Well, I'm totally wiped out by everything surrounding this pandemic.  People here chock up all the California fires, the fires here, the hottest driest summer on record in Arizona, the double whammy hurricanes in the gulf to "it's just 2020".   In Arizona, I cannot get a test unless I have symptoms.  The university in Tucson has a rapid-result test they are testing all the returning students with and have a special quarantine dorm.  Last weekend, they reported 200 new cases - all from off-campus kids.  And that's before the past holiday weekend.  I presume there will be a lot of Covid cases in two weeks.

And to top it off, we found out today  - on taped trump recordings that are part of a new book - that he knew before the first week of February that this was airborne, highly contagious and very lethal yet downplayed it, called it a hoax, not as bad as the flu (it's at least 5 times more lethal), everything is fine, it'll miraculously go away.  He carried on with that for two months.  No way to know if anyone else in our government or health services were made aware of the dangers.  And certainly no action was taken to protect the American public.  

I am healthy and I don't personally know anyone who has gotten sick, but I know of countless who have lost their jobs, or their business.  Those volunteer jobs I had evaporated.   And the disruption to "regular" life goes on.  I can't travel, even within the states, let alone out of the country.  There have been no other human beings in my house in six months (except when my son came to surprise me on my birthday in May.)   Isolation is the new normal. 

So, it is really difficult and exhausting here.  And no end in sight.  I think that's the hardest thing - no end in sight.  At almost 200K deaths.

If the U.S. had acted responsibly, with awareness of what was really happening, we'd be more like Canada now.  Or Germany.  Or even Spain.  At least 100,000 people wouldn't have died and we wouldn't be looking at the potential for another 1-2 hundred thousand dead by the end of the year.

Bottom line?  Still no federal response, no national testing strategy, inadequate testing availability.  Scary and infuriating.  So, I guess I'm hanging in there, but not really okay.

Oh, and I forgot that the US will not, at present,  be participating in any WHO vaccine development or testing because the president "doesn't trust" China.  This is grim.

[rockstaryuzu]

20 hours ago, barbara said:

And to top it off, we found out today  - on taped trump recordings that are part of a new book - that he knew before the first week of February that this was airborne, highly contagious and very lethal yet downplayed it, called it a hoax, not as bad as the flu (it's at least 5 times more lethal), everything is fine, it'll miraculously go away.  He carried on with that for two months

So all of that wasn't just Trump's general dumbcluckery, it was deliberate?! 

[barbara]

6 minutes ago, rockstaryuzu said:

So all of that wasn't just Trump's general dumbcluckery, it was deliberate?! 

"Dereliction of duty".  He has blood on his hands.  It's absolutely nefarious.

[rockstaryuzu]

49 minutes ago, barbara said:

"Dereliction of duty".  He has blood on his hands.  It's absolutely nefarious.

You can say that again. 

[liv]

On 9/10/2020 at 5:23 PM, barbara said:

"Dereliction of duty".  He has blood on his hands.  It's absolutely nefarious.

 

Nefarious. Dumbcluckery. Both are apt.

 

I don't know which is worse... that he knew the truth and totally and deliberately lied, to supposedly prevent panic (in doing so comparing himself to Churchill), leading to where things stand now... or the idea that he was stupid enough to not really understand how serious it was and that led to where things stand now...  either way, things didn't have to be this way.  And yet, I believe I have heard that his chance for re-election is still high?

 

It seems that cases are very slowly rising here in Ontario. I see everyone wearing masks now in public places, but the number of people I see gathering and socializing is quite high... and many of them aren't wearing masks or keeping their distance from each other. I guess they've decided that big bubbles of people are ok, but shopping by yourself is dangerous...  and yet here I am staying away from anyone/anything because of my need to protect my seniors at my long term care home.  Today I seem a bit depressed for some reason, even though it's a nice day and we just had figure skating to watch and there's tennis this afternoon... Covid gets to us all at some point... even if you don't actually * contract it* yourself. It will all pass, though, it will pass...

[rockstaryuzu]

On 9/12/2020 at 2:29 PM, liv said:

 

 

It seems that cases are very slowly rising here in Ontario. I see everyone wearing masks now in public places, but the number of people I see gathering and socializing is quite high... and many of them aren't wearing masks or keeping their distance from each other. I guess they've decided that big bubbles of people are ok, but shopping by yourself is dangerous...  and yet here I am staying away from anyone/anything because of my need to protect my seniors at my long term care home.  Today I seem a bit depressed for some reason, even though it's a nice day and we just had figure skating to watch and there's tennis this afternoon... Covid gets to us all at some point... even if you don't actually * contract it* yourself. It will all pass, though, it will pass...

The rise in cases in Ontario in the last couple of weeks is not wholly unexpected, though, IMO . We just had all the university students come back, and school started - more people are moving around in public, and more of those people are from a demographic group that so far doesn't seem to have gotten any of the messages about COVID at all. (I was out for a walk downtown last Thursday and the place was awash in non-masked, non-social-distancing students...made my skin crawl to be honest). It's so depressing when you're someone who is trying hard to be responsible about it. 

 

That being said, my brain turned a corner on this whole thing last week. I came to conclusion that it's time to start planning for when this thing is over. The world is going through some wild changes right now and when the dust settles, I want those changes to be for the better, so it's time to do what's in my power to make that happen. If I keep my eye on that goal now, then the rest of this pandemic will not seem so endless or difficult, I think. 

 

 

[SitTwizzle]

1 hour ago, rockstaryuzu said:

The rise in cases in Ontario in the last couple of weeks is not wholly unexpected, though, IMO . We just had all the university students come back, and school started - more people are moving around in public, and more of those people are from a demographic group that so far doesn't seem to have gotten any of the messages about COVID at all. (I was out for a walk downtown last Thursday and the place was awash in non-masked, non-social-distancing students...made my skin crawl to be honest). It's so depressing when you're someone who is trying hard to be responsible about it. 

 

That being said, my brain turned a corner on this whole thing last week. I came to conclusion that it's time to start planning for when this thing is over. The world is going through some wild changes right now and when the dust settles, I want those changes to be for the better, so it's time to do what's in my power to make that happen. If I keep my eye on that goal now, then the rest of this pandemic will not seem so endless or difficult, I think. 

 

 

The thing is, technically it will never be "over". It is likely to remain endemic like other coronaviruses. Unless there is a completely innovative technique of vaccine or other protection (as innovative as the vaccine itself when it was invented), any CoViD vaccine will protect only partly, and this partly is quite unlikely to be a lot — like flu vaccines etc, particularly for the elderly. Not enough to get virtually rid of it, unlike for instance the roughly 90% efficiency of condom would suffice to get rid of AIDS if all who should deigned wear them.

Plus, all laboratories seem very willing to test vaccines on the general population, even knowing (and only partly) there had been rather worrying side-effects on previous coronavirus vaccine tests. Primum non nocere (first, don't harm) have been a principle of medicine since more than two millenia. And all governments seem ready to give them leave to do so and take the consequences upon themselves. And to all other sorts of dictatorial nonsense instead of prudent and coherent behaviour.

[Sombreuil]

I ventured into the city centre yesterday to actually get out of the car and walk round, as opposed to driving through,  for the first time since March.  Won’t be going again in a hurry.  Lots of signage concerning one way foot traffic, entering shops by one entrance and exiting by another, all ignored, and for every person wearing a mask, four or five who weren’t.  No wonder everyone thinks a local lockdown is imminent.

[SitTwizzle]

A little laugh : swan mask police.

The message in French means : "You were told to wear your mask!"