General Yuzuru Chat

[SSS]

1 minute ago, Shayuzu said:

what who shakes whos hand? im confused 

Yuzu and the one who took picture of Yuzu...

[Shayuzu]

2 minutes ago, SSS said:

Yuzu and the one who took picture of Yuzu...

i'm jealous and sad now.. do you have the pic or link?

[katonice]

This off-season has really been packed with treats for us fans.

It seems just a while ago when FaOI ended, and now we're anticipating his skating clinic with kids,

with lots of photo appearances, media coverage, announcements, videos and other stuff in between.

We all are getting spoiled with a regular diet of our BB! 

[SSS]

Besides the two shared above...

5 minutes ago, Shayuzu said:

i'm jealous and sad now.. do you have the pic or link?

 

 

 

[SSS]

BTW, I went to a Japanese bookstore in downtown (where I found figure skating Life last time) today, I found フィギュアスケートファン通信21  only $15.99...

how heavy is a magazine?  still trying to figure out how to buy all the magazines together on amazon.co.jp...

[kamotejojo]

YzRIKO's uploads this morning:

 

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

11 時間前, SSSさんが言いました:

I don't understand why there are many people saying they are okay if Yuzu cleans both program and not getting the gold...

To me, if that happens, I will question the judges' scores... Even if he is not super clean, he should win if judges follow the rules. As a fan, I understand yuzu's goal to deliver perfect programs and win gold at the same time. Gold medal is as important. I will support whatever his decision is. Like if he wants to remove 3f... I may worry because of politics and judging, but I will never distrust his programs. It is common to recycle programs, lower BV for Olympics..I think our "disappointment" should not give media an excuse to criticize Yuzu only...And I don't want to see someone's news article about how he beats the GOAT in Olympics...I don't think anyone else deserve the gold if Yuzu does not mess up.

 

9 時間前, BrightonDogwoodsさんが言いました:

I also believe that between 2 possible outcomes  (out of many):

1. He skates perfect but does not win (assuming fair judging)

2. He falls 2x on FS but wins anyways

 

If he skates clean with no downgrade from, say, even his current layout, there would be absolutely no argument that he should be on top, even if everyone else and their mothers and mammoth BVs skate clean and had better momentum going in. The only way he'd lose is through under-the-table dealings. Or one of those skaters or their mom suddenly develop Hanyu-like skills on the ice. This is the reality of where Yuzuru Hanyu stands in terms of strength in present times. A perfect Hanyu is, as of the next few years at least, unrivalled. This is something he's made objectively clear even in a sport that is thus far, subjective. And until someone who can rival, truly rival, or perhaps even surpass him in level of completeness appears, it will remain as such. Though they wouldn't actually be rivals because by the time this person or persons appear--and it very well could be one of the boys competing today--Hanyu would've been long r****d.

 

So if he doesn't win despite clean skates even with his current BV (some 89 point something for his FS, was it?), no it's not okay, because not only is it criminal, but it'd be a very, very dark smudge on the sport and the Games, instead of something infinitely beautiful (who knows with these muttonheads...unbridled  human greed is a very real thing, after all), on a scale larger than any previous Games scandals or controversies. I can't imagine any amount of money would be worth that, and not to mention whoever they let win above an awe-inspiring Hanyu at his very best (at that point in time) ultimately won't really get to enjoy their victory all that much, so it'd be a disservice to them as well because regardless of how high their BVs or how error-free their performance, nobody with properly functioning brains and eyes will truly see them as deserving, not with Hanyu out there in the field and having delivered his best (because, as said earlier, the playing field is *not* a level one at the end of the day currently, which is why others have no choice but to stack BVs and count on Hanyu faltering--which Hanyu cannot afford to do now with this strategy being used against him (and working), so the guy is literally being forced to skate clean, which perfectly explains his program choices this season), but humans have done worse things for less. Which is why, short of boycotting the Games, or even ISU events, for the rest of our lives, there's really nothing anybody as individuals can do about it.

 

So instead of stressing over that, because that's just folly (cos seriously, if I let myself be stressed over human issues I can't do anything about, most of which will continue to exist as long as humans are around, I'd only develop psychological ones myself and no one else would be suffering for it but myself and my family), I'd rather just focus on the one thing that I know for sure will give me life--and we all know what that is, because I'm sure it's basically the same for all of us here.

 

And believe it or not, I actually find the second scenario more cringey, not because he wouldn't have deserved the win (I imagine this is only possible if everyone else made even more costly mistakes) but because of the inevitable fallout due to its similarity with Sochi. Gold or no gold, avoiding an outcome where his delivery is less than perfect is a major part of the reason why he's been driving himself so hard, even by his standards, these last few years. What he truly deserves is to win in a way that would garner absolutely no questions and no dissenters, in a way that even those who don't want him to win have to accept it, however grudgingly. So I really don't want either of the two scenarios to happen but if we set medal color aside, I'd really, really prefer clean skates from the guy. Not for myself, or anyone else, but for him.

 

Because, as evidenced in past Games, it's not simply the color of the medal that truly impresses the masses that paid attention, but how memorable the performance. And as long as his is a memorable one, even for him, chances are high that the gold can't not go to him, if the organizers want their event to go down in history as one of the greatest (as any other outcome would deliver the opposite effect), with the only thing that could top the show being two or more players on the field that are like him. It's a very real possibility in future Games, too, if this next one goes down in history the right way.

[katonice]

The yearly media day arrival tradition...

 

[CupidsBow]

6 hours ago, Danibellerika said:

I think people can think what they want about it honestly.  I can't pretend skating Chopin three times excites me much and I'm a Yuzuber.  But I have accepted it. If anybody roots against him they were looking for a reason anyway and aren't worth the thought or energy. Can't do anything about it. I don't like when people completely backload a program sacrificing good structure and a balanced performance for the sake of points, and I'd like for them to NOT get that 10% bonus for all but 4-5 passes, but I can't fault them for going for it if it helps them strategically as things are now. At the end of the day, my feelings and anybody else's feelings don't matter. Nobody's breaking any rules by doing any of these things in their skating.  The chips will fall where they will fall. 

 

ehhh I get that Ballade for a 3rd season is not as exciting as him getting a new SP (or bringing back smth else, like if he brought back étude) but it's a solid choice with solid reasoning behind it and has a high chance of yielding good results. I get the feeling the plan for SP was different at some point but the sad nose-drive LGC had in the second half of the season shook Yuzu's confidence, which would make for a bad condition to introduce a new SP. Ballade is something he can skate confidently with, up the technical, add some additional difficulty and skate his best to. And I certainly still enjoy past renditions of the program, I will enjoy future performances too. People complaining it's not exciting or is somehow a cop-out are overlooking the reasoning behind that choice. 

With Seimei...honestly, I don't understand why Seimei is the one getting people worked up. Even after Seimei was announced I would have thought the complaints about 'two recycled programs' would be more directed at Ballade. Everyone, Hanyu uber or not, has said that Seimei was Olympic material since NHK. The reasons for using it are way clearer than Ballade. And with the promise of upgrades, it's still exciting to think about, even if it's going to be Seimei's second season.

 

It's like...I'm not looking forward to another free program where there's 4-5 front-loaded quads rammed into the start of a program with no content between them but when you have so many skaters saying they'll do a 5 or 6 quad program you know that's what you're going to get (except for from Hanyu, who actually tries to put out a well-balanced program, same can be said for Javi and Patrick if they opt to up their quad content too) but I can't fault the idea behind it. People just need to remember that, while performance and audience enjoyment is important, these skaters are not doing competitive programs for you, they are doing them for the judges and they are doing what they can to win. Does Yuzu know that some of the audience is going to be unhappy he has no new program? Of course he does, but he's got to do what he thinks gives him the best chance of winning. Do the sQuad know that a minute or two of nothing but skate-skate-jump is dull to watch and should lower the kind of PCS they should get? Sure but they know their PCS won't be massive anyway and they want a shot at winning. Just like the ladies know that backloading as many jumps as they can and adding tanos to everything can be a drag to watch, but they've got to do what they can to win.

 

on another note: I kinda hope it doesn't become a common thing for fans to creep on Yuzu's departure flights? Arrivals, esp for major competitions, is kind of an inevitable thing and media will be there too but finding out departure flights and going to see him off...I kinda hope he doesn't get that a lot. It feels hypocritical to say because I do this for idols (find out/guess departure and arrival flights and go to the airport for photos) but for idols they expect it and it's almost part of their job (i've had managers and the idols themselves tell me their flight info before). Yuzu isn't an idol... idk it seems a bit intrusive given the context. I'm gonna give the girl the benefit of the doubt that maybe she just happened to be flying the same day and spotted him, but... I hope Yuzu gets some space

[Plumqueen]

On 8/12/2017 at 7:18 PM, kaerb said:

O:! Are we famous? Do you have a link to the video? 

No, unfortunately I watched it on my TV then it disappeared.  The title ended in SEIMEI!

I'll search for it again.  I honestly figured it was created from someone here, and I was the last one to see it.

[axelsandwich]

It's a case of 'don't hate the player hate the game' when it comes to jumping and program composition and recycling. The only way to amend the trend is if they get punished via their PCS or the rulebook and there are no measures in place right now for any of that. Yuzu's strength is that he's equally capable of getting both marks. This Olympics, all the talk about Yuzu's 'perfect program' is essentially outlining a program that will achieve top PCS and TES (and in doing so leave a 'memorable impression' on the audience and likely make him unbeatable if he can do both as we've seen). Him recycling his two programs is a way of increasing the chances of getting top PCs because it frees him to focus on perfecting his layout (ie. TES and where his strongest challengers are currently because their BVs are higher). It's everyone playing the game, really -- at the end of the day, as much as we may emphasise 'artistic integrity', I don't fault any of the athletes for increasing their chances of getting the final prize.  

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

7 時間前, CupidsBowさんが言いました:

 

ehhh I get that Ballade for a 3rd season is not as exciting as him getting a new SP (or bringing back smth else, like if he brought back étude) but it's a solid choice with solid reasoning behind it and has a high chance of yielding good results. I get the feeling the plan for SP was different at some point but the sad nose-drive LGC had in the second half of the season shook Yuzu's confidence, which would make for a bad condition to introduce a new SP. Ballade is something he can skate confidently with, up the technical, add some additional difficulty and skate his best to. And I certainly still enjoy past renditions of the program, I will enjoy future performances too. People complaining it's not exciting or is somehow a cop-out are overlooking the reasoning behind that choice. 

With Seimei...honestly, I don't understand why Seimei is the one getting people worked up. Even after Seimei was announced I would have thought the complaints about 'two recycled programs' would be more directed at Ballade. Everyone, Hanyu uber or not, has said that Seimei was Olympic material since NHK. The reasons for using it are way clearer than Ballade. And with the promise of upgrades, it's still exciting to think about, even if it's going to be Seimei's second season.

 

It's like...I'm not looking forward to another free program where there's 4-5 front-loaded quads rammed into the start of a program with no content between them but when you have so many skaters saying they'll do a 5 or 6 quad program you know that's what you're going to get (except for from Hanyu, who actually tries to put out a well-balanced program, same can be said for Javi and Patrick if they opt to up their quad content too) but I can't fault the idea behind it. People just need to remember that, while performance and audience enjoyment is important, these skaters are not doing competitive programs for you, they are doing them for the judges and they are doing what they can to win. Does Yuzu know that some of the audience is going to be unhappy he has no new program? Of course he does, but he's got to do what he thinks gives him the best chance of winning. Do the sQuad know that a minute or two of nothing but skate-skate-jump is dull to watch and should lower the kind of PCS they should get? Sure but they know their PCS won't be massive anyway and they want a shot at winning. Just like the ladies know that backloading as many jumps as they can and adding tanos to everything can be a drag to watch, but they've got to do what they can to win.

 

on another note: I kinda hope it doesn't become a common thing for fans to creep on Yuzu's departure flights? Arrivals, esp for major competitions, is kind of an inevitable thing and media will be there too but finding out departure flights and going to see him off...I kinda hope he doesn't get that a lot. It feels hypocritical to say because I do this for idols (find out/guess departure and arrival flights and go to the airport for photos) but for idols they expect it and it's almost part of their job (i've had managers and the idols themselves tell me their flight info before). Yuzu isn't an idol... idk it seems a bit intrusive given the context. I'm gonna give the girl the benefit of the doubt that maybe she just happened to be flying the same day and spotted him, but... I hope Yuzu gets some space

 

7 時間前, kaerbさんが言いました:

It's a case of 'don't hate the player hate the game' when it comes to jumping and program composition and recycling. The only way to amend the trend is if they get punished via their PCS. Yuzu's strength is that he's equally capable of getting both marks. This Olympics, all the talk about Yuzu's 'perfect program' is essentially outlining a program that will achieve top PCS and TES (and in doing so leave a 'memorable impression' on the audience and likely make him unbeatable if he can do both as we've seen). Him recycling his two programs is a way of increasing the chances of getting top PCs because it frees him to focus on perfecting his layout (ie. TES and where his strongest challengers are currently because their BVs are higher). It's everyone playing the game, really -- at the end of the day, as much as we may emphasise 'artistic integrity', I don't fault any of the athletes for increasing their chances of getting the final prize.  

 

As much as I advocate Hanyu's choices this season, I don't actually feel there's anything essentially wrong with people being disappointed in them. I mean noone here is expressing disappointment in him (though I can't say the same for people on other mediums). But as FS fans, and Hanyu fans especially, we want to see maybe at least one new program from the guy who's been wowwing us, one way or another, for almost his entire career. It's pretty much an involuntary desire at this point. And generally, that's not asking for much, all things considered. But being the Oly season, most would eventually come to accept that there'll be no new programs from some skaters (Hanyu being one of them) because of highly understandable reasons. As fans, our brains and, to a far extent, even our hearts fully understand, and if given a choice between seeing him struggle with new progs and potentially not deliver when it matters the most as opposed to recycled ones with greater potential of the best outcome, every single one of us would pick the latter choice  in a heartbeat. But until we are explicitly given the turnaround, we can't quite curb the disappointment still, on what is simply a mere promise. I get that. And that's fine.

 

But what gets to me is people confusing having to essentially see familiar programs with the skater backpedalling. That isn't even a misjudgment anymore. It's a complete misidentification. Programs are a major part of a skater's career, yes, but they are not what make the skaters. Programs are merely vehicles, or tools, (I did say more on this later, and it's later) and what they do with them, the kind of life they breathe into them, is what makes them the kind of skaters they are known for. Sure, doing the same program over and over and over without strong reasons behind it can easily be seen as lazy or simply cowardly if they don't have a good reason for it, even if they were to consistently up the ante in terms of tech and layout, and sometimes, perhaps, it is. But so long as they're upping their ante, even if a skater were to stick to the same two programs their entire career, it's *not* a step back. What it is, is a form of stagnating, and while not the most exciting of choices, we all know that it's sometimes necessary.

 

As far as Hanyu is concerned, we can definitively conclude that he is the last person we should ever have the gall to label as "lazy" and " cowardly" without outing ourselves as blind and forgetful imbeciles. And since no one is doing that (here at least), even if some of us are more bitterly disappointed than others, I'm glad that none of us here are that.

 

But Hanyu has chosen to stagnate this season in terms of program choices. Let's acknowledge that. But game or no game, this is the first step, a necessary one, towards delivering clean skates of his level on a consistent basis. And I believe that if he captures the feeling of it, he might be able to evolve even further and deliver clean skates more consistently even with new programs and higher difficulty next time, thus finally breaking his old pattern. And though some of us may be more bitterly disappointed than others at this turn of events for this particular season, if he's able to deliver what he promises, and grow even more for the future, then I'm sure we'll all be extremely glad for it at the end of the day.

 

For now, we'll have to sit down and allow ourselves to think properly: would you give someone with a new program but essentially the same, or if not exactly the same, then similar, theme they've been doing since time immemorial more credit than Hanyu, who's repeating a program that he's picked out amidst the plethora of themes he's explored and given us across the last few seasons, and one that's, when compared to everyone else, warhorse or no warhorse, is quintessentially different? He's doing an ethnic program, for chrissakes, which most of the rest of the world has never seen a top contender in the field do. On Olympic ice. The fact that he even feels confident enough to give the world that is precisely because he's tested it out before *and* knows that the world is capable of accepting it. If we're going to be disappointed that his FS is a repeat, then I think we should similarly be disappointed with those who are using new programs but are essentially sticking to the same old theme they're known for. That's only fair, I feel.

 

All said, we'll all come to realize that there's no real point of contention for his choice to revisit SEIMEI. I think people are more lamenting that he'll be repeating both progs and SEIMEI just happened to be the last one announced since the ship for Chopin has sailed long ago. I'll admit I wasn't as thrilled when that was announced, much as it also deserves to be a Hanyu Oly prog. But I was also aware that LGC did a number on him and the next season is really not one to be experimenting, especially since he may be nearing the end of his competitive career and needs to show the world the culmination of all his effort. Knowing that, and that his choices are limited for the kind of showing he wants to give, I accepted it without complaint. *shrug* I think the guy himself most probably feels the exact same way with having to repeat his SP as well, especially since he's decided to stick with SEIMEI since day one. I'll be truthful, though, it wasn't until I saw what he made of it in the recent ice shows he did that the small disappointment fully lifted.

 

So...this is what happens when I'm kept idling in the waiting room...everyone else has to suffer torrents of word vomit. Better pray they don't keep me waiting any longer...

[SparkleSalad]

My feelings are that those two programs are materpieces that not only deserve to be at the Olympics but deserve to be skated by the master at the peak of his ability. He has improved so much since 2015 and already we've seen how much more intense and powerful he's made Chopin. How could anyone not relish the opportunity to see an even more powerful SEIMEI? Chopin 3 literally took my breath away, will I even survive SEIMEI?

 

I'm not bothered by differing opinions or criticisms from the media, just unable to understand.

[CupidsBow]

I think expressing disappointment in his choices is one thing and extensive criticism going as far as saying he will not deserve to win at the Olympics because of this decision is another. I also think some of the criticism of the decision goes too far; suggesting he has no artistic merit? for these programs? the fuck? 

 

It does make me hope Yuzu will stay on for a few more seasons to experiment more with different kinds of music and push out more unique programs (it also makes me hopeful he will do this seeing as he expressed an interest in doing this but has pretty much spent this Olympic cycle refining Ballade and building his skills to pull off Seimei even better the second time around) but like it has been said elsewhere, there's nothing in the rules about a limit to reusing programs so hoping the judges penalise him for doing so (or reward others for not reusing a program) is just petty. I think seeing both programs again, with more difficult layouts and alternations to choreography, is just going to show how much Yuzuru has improved since the last time they were performed. 

 

ETA: Also... Olympics get a lot of casual viewers who don't keep up with the sport and only watch when Oly rolls around. As FS fans surely you'd want the best skaters to be displaying their best programs to show the sport at its absolute peak when the audience is at its highest?

Hanyu picked up a lot of new fans who got more invested in the sport at Sochi. The men's event is incredibly exciting at the moment - if Pyeongchang is anything close to Helsinki Worlds a lot of that casual Olympic audience will be a lot more interested in the sport than before. Especially with Yuzu showing his best programs so far. I think both programs encapsulate a lot of Yuzu's appeal in the aesthetic, the technical, the display of skating skills, the graceful and gentle beauty of Ballade and the fierceness of Seimei. Yuzu has his crazy popularity because he offers a lot to the audience on a lot of different levels. I will not be surprised if there is a flood of even more Hanyu fans after Pyeongchang. (esp if he has a more playful exhibition piece. that would be a triple kill tbh). We'll see about others' programs as the season starts but right now we know that when it comes to appealing to the general audience and using the Olympics as a way to promote the sport, Yuzu has a lot of potential. Javi also has a lot to offer the audience, Boyang has a lot of charm (seeing as how his programs last year made everyone just fall in love with him) but we'll see if his new programs get that charm across. The other top men could fall either way depending on their programs - but at least we know for sure Yuzuru will have hella impact on the casual crowd.

[KatjaThera]

Just the other day, I read an old interview with Yuzu, from his senior debut season, in which he said his generation have to add quads, because they can't compete with the veterans otherwise. I thought that sounded familiar. The big difference, to me, was that Yuzu used quads to boost his speed a little, but never gave up on the rest. (Of course, back then "add quads" meant having 1 quad vs. having none. So BV increase wasn't that great and overall wasn't 'spectacular' enough to drag PCS up as well. ) For Yuzu, adding quads I guess was part of getting him a bit closer to the top while he worked on the rest. Of course, the true work started after he moved to Canada - and kudos, again, to Brian; I wonder if Yuzu had gone to another coach, to learn to jump quads, if they'd also said: sorry, no, skating skills first. By the time of Sochi, he was already pretty much there.

 

I guess the big problem with the quadsters is they don't have time. Yuzu came to the senior scene with four seasons to go. And moved to Brian with two. The quadsters came with two or one season to go. And yet they want to fight for Olympic Gold. Adding quads and increased BVs are the only way they stand a chance. I think what grates is that they don't seem to have a longer term plan and there hasn't been proof that for them, too, counting on quads is just a temporary thing, until they grow as skaters.

 

Shoma is probably the closest in terms of trying and aiming for the Yuzu-style of figure skating. But if he doesn't work on his jump technique, that'll be a "does he really mean it?" thing.

 

I've seen people say Boyang has been working on the artistic side. I haven't followed him, so I can't say, but he is fun to watch. In a way, I guess he's also the one who clearly has a longer term plan, because he'll definitely want to be there for the next Olympics. I guess consistency is his biggest issue - and probably the hardest to fix, for any skater.

 

Last year's FS has made Nathan the most disappointing of them. The SP proves he can do better, but if the FS doesn't improve, if he ever wins over Yuzu again - or in fact any of the others - people will talk again. I think there actually wouldn't be this much talk about piling quads upon quads if the Nathan hype and wins hadn't happened. But I guess, he has the shortest term plan and if he wants to win OG, he has no other choice. Sad though it is for the sport. (And really, Nathan getting a gold medal with an FS like last year's, so he can then quit, at 18 years of age, would probably be the worst thing for the sport right now.)

 

Quads are exciting, but we've pretty much reached the limit already. OK, someone might bring in the axel and then tried to make every jump a quad. Great. Then what? Quints won't happen that soon - if at all - and there would be many injuries. But there'll be no way to move further without maybe taking a few steps back, or just watch the sport slowly die by itself, as everyone does 7 quads and virtually nothing else. So, I'm not sure even politically it'd be smart to help the others beat Yuzu. (I guess they could give it to Shoma instead, but is rewarding his - apparently; I can't say anything myself - bad technique a good idea for the sport? A perfect Boyang, maybe, if his skills have truly improved, but that's a matter of luck. And I'm not sure Javi or Patrick stand a chance anymore, though I'd prefer them rounding off the podium for a silent: "Enough is enough! This is figure skating, not jump skating." message.

 

And I got way carried away.

 

I still have issues with Chopin, for personal taste reasons. I understand why he chose it - though, I admit, I might be projecting, but in the FaOI performances, he doesn't seem happy with it, to me; more like he had no other choice. Which in a way is true. For this "aim for consistency" plan, when LGC fell through, he had no other choice (PW would be overkill :P). Though now I wonder what an adult, upgraded Etude would have been like... Anyway, it is music he knows and he will probably do wonders with it anyway. But I hate seeing him apparently not so happy. But again, I might be projecting, since pretty much everyone else says they feel moved by the performances.

 

I don't understand why anyone would have problems with Seimei, though - beyond personal taste, again. It was a commanding program already in 2015-2016. Adding the gorgeousness of H&L and applying it to Seimei, improving it, it will probably be mind blowing.

 

But I think most of the worries aren't so much about Seimei, but about BV and layout and judges and the overall "repeating two programs" thing, even though those are arguably his best programs to date. It would be nice if we could stop worrying about things we can't help, but worrying about something one cares about, is another thing that can't really be helped, I think lol.