Cerunias

Hang on. Which one is LGC? Is it supposed to be top right?

Too true, given his early list of achievements by the time he left Sendai for Toronto. And clearly Abe gave Hanyu a great foundation to build on - as Orser himself has pointed out. And the fact that she recommended to Hanyu to seek out another coach to further improve and evolve to the next level - that says a lot (of positive things) about her as well and her "willingness to give up" an elite skater. Of course, while there are those who would say that a lot of it came down to Hanyu's own skill, talent, and hard work, if he didn't have a great coach/mentor like Nanami-sensei, and Minoru-san before (who encouraged and taught Hanyu to love skating), he would have been hard-pressed to unleash these attributes to their full potential. Scientists are wont to say that they "stand on shoulders of giants". The principle surely applies here too. Without Nanami Abe and Minoru Sano, Hanyu wouldn't be where he is today (whether with or without Brian Orser). I think that's why it was fantastic that he recognised both of them in CiONTU.

Just to put this thought/opinion out there: I don't think this will be a major issue, at least initially. This is not the first time that someone on this thread has speculated about how much the Fed of each skater now going to TCC may be involved or may "interfere". Just a day or two ago were posts questioning the extent the Chinese Fed may be involved with Jin's training at TCC, for example. Referring back to the documentary re Javier Fernandez and his training with Brian Orser and the team at TCC, it is clear from Orser's interview comments that one of the conditions he sets with the Feds is that it is "his way, or no way at all". It would seem he did this with both with the Spanish Fed and the Japanese Fed. Orser has a training method, and he sticks to the principles of that method. So I would be very surprised if Orser hadn't set that as a condition with the Russian Fed already. And ditto with the Chinese Fed and the US Fed, with reference to the previous posts in this thread speculating about how hands-on the Chinese Fed will be with Jin and the US Fed with Brown. Given his success with first Kim, and then Fernandez and Hanyu, I would imagine that Orser has earned himself quite a bit of bargaining power in this regard, and he strikes me as a person who wouldn't hesitate to use this power if he felt that it would be to the benefit of his skaters and helps him to do his job (based on his comments in past interviews and behaviour in past events). One cannot deny that the principles of his method are effective based on his track record, and given each Fed wants to see results, they would be fools to interfere with Orser's methods! Now, if there isn't some proof of results or potential for results come the start of the second year, then you might hear some rumbles from some Feds (if only out of impatience). What I would be interested in is how Orser's training method will evolve to be able to do justice to the training of so many elite skaters now. It is clear from Orser's previous interviews that he takes great care to not favour one skater over another (ie Fernandez and Hanyu), and now he has double the number of elite skaters than he did pre-PC!

As Orser has said a number of times regarding his athletes, you don't see results immediately when he gets new athletes, but rather, only after about 18 months. For example, in the case of Yuzuru, Orser himself has said that although he got good foundations from Abe, he tended to skate a bit fast and loose and so they started from those foundations again and worked their way up. Orser himself has also described his coaching principle of skills first, then allowing those skills to enable artistry. So it all 'makes sense', and I would expect similar will be seen with Medvedeva, Jin, and Brown over the next two years.

Thanks for the link. I recall that documentary very well, having only watched it again a few days ago. Without watching it again since a few days ago to double check the exact quote and wording, I seem to recall there was a bit that said he looked up a lot of stuff (where exactly was unspecified) about his injury and treatment and recovery for his injury. I also recall that I winced at the time when I heard that while watching (and more recently rewatching), and also hoped that he wasn't relying on bad advice available over the Internet (in the same way that I commented on a few posts ago) - it is one of my bugbears that there is so much crap passing off as legit advice on the Internet when it comes to health and healthcare. As a side point, believe me when I say that many well-educated people with access to appropriate resources sometimes still also inappropriately trust some dubious Internet source. I've lost track of the number of reasonably educated people who sit in my clinic and wanting some inappropriate treatment they had googled the day before coming...it is, in my opinion, one of the greatest problems of the Internet that any Tom, Dick, or Harry can post anything they like on the Internet and pass off as experts - amongst the worst is not the stuff that is outrageously inaccurate but rather, it is the stuff that is inaccurate or false (or fake) but is close enough to the truth to survive a first-pass examination by someone who doesn't have expertise in that particular area. Cognitive psychologists have well-demonstrated that we often overestimate our own ability to determine what is fake and what is not, particularly if what is fake only deviates from the truth slightly albeit significantly. Just look at American politics as an excellent example of that, and the whole Obama birther conspiracy as one example, the whole (5 million) illegal voters conspiracy as another example. In the latter case, for example, a significant proportion of Republican-identifying voting-aged people believe it true that there were 5 million illegal voters voting for Clinton despite there being absolutely no evidence of there being that scale of illegal voting at the last US Presidential election (yes, there were a few illegal votes and no system is perfect, but nowhere near even 1% of 5 million!).

@LadyLou: Just to reflect the number of abbreviations that led to your suggestion for this glossary and your current hard work (I know this is still a WiP): UA Nessie (I think I'm being blind, but I don't see it?) Carrot cake COR Sparkle salad Seaweed Potato sack pants Trashbag pants Strawberry Boobskirt CiONTU and of course Yuzudory Re the above, I refer to the General chat thread, page 3572 and 3573 where some discussion were had about the number of abbreviations, and the need for this glossary (of which, if I recall correctly, you were involved in the discussion).

But Tracy is already Snow White! Maybe Brian is the King. Or Huntsman? Not sure the latter really fits.

What a well thought comment! Hiya lurker Yuzuru! Congratulations! Should be just about big and shiny enough for Yuzuru, do you think? He's soon going to need the equivalent of the Tower of London for all of his shinies! https://english.kyodonews.net/news/2018/06/fe7fa9523c01-ohtani-most-popular-athlete-in-japan-nationwide-survey.html 3rd most popular athlete in Japan (only)! Sorry, Yuzuru, you'll have to settle for bronze on this survey and enjoy your other gold shinies!

Fixed. Having read through the last three pages, I completely agree @kaeryth. Remember that interview of Tracy (and Brian) where Tracy pointed out that Brian does have a somewhat unique perspective on handling the media and handling pressure? She discussed how Brian was the hope for Canadian Olympic gold but lost the "Battle of the Brians" and missed out and essentially spent many years after that developing a system to cope with the media and with pressure. And then there was that interview re the media blowup due to Javier's comment re homosexuality prior to Sochi, which was unfortunately poor phrased and easily misconstrued - Brian's recollection of that event and the advice he gave to Javier says a lot about Brian's mentality and attitude towards the media, and also shows that Brian is not hesitant to teach his skaters what he learnt of things off the ice as well. Not that any of the other coaches or choreographers would be slouches themselves when it comes to handling the media, having been champions in their own right. This team is not new to to handling journalists! All I can say in summary of the majority of the last two or three pages of this thread, is "oh ye of little faith"!

Poor Yuzuru - why does he end up being Grumpy? And where does Brian fit in within this scheme of things?

So basically Phil Hersh is Rita Skeeter? That one quoted comment has multiple degrees of meaning! Given the way Orser operates - as he has done so over the years - surely people should trust him that he has his skaters' best interests at heart? Orser is not exactly a fame-seeking guy, he strikes me as a guy who truly wants to train good skaters and create beautiful programs. People seem a little too ready to make Orser public enemy #1. Too much judgement...too little trust and faith. Strikes me that people are thinking too much, and creating little fantasies within their head, as they can't live without knowing every little tiny detail. Ladies and gentlemen, that's what the world has devolved to nowadays with its penchant for soundbites - we take a little something, and let it spin into yards of fantastical gold. We ignore the fact that Rumpelstiltskin may turn up one day and exact a price.

Well, I guess he doesn't want to eat his gold medals

Hmm...one missing still, looking at that glove...who could that be?

.... Why on earth would anyone juxtapose those two programs together? And more to the point, why would you juxtapose those two programs' music together... A week or two ago, I commented that it seemed like the Olympics channel finally worked out how to get more clicks and views on their channel and feed. Now it just seems like they've gone overboard with too much of a good thing...out of sheer desperation to keep things going on a good roll, they create this...er...messy media...

Are you thinking that Hanyu was watching a lot of Transformers or something - and latched onto the idea of a 'combiner' Transformer - let's combine all of these different people's different strengths and create a super skater!

Tabloids don't need logic. In fact, often the more illogical something is, the better tabloids fare with that story for the interest they garner. All tabloids need is rumour and interest. As I commented previously in response to the thought from @micaelis about 2-3 pages ago (that you quoted in part above 3 posts ago), disinterest is what helps kill tabloid stories. The more we comment (even if we think we're helping by being against the rumour), the more interest and curiosity we generate that help tabloids survive and garner sales.

Unfortunately, it'd be like throwing fat on the fire; all the more a shame because that could be a fantastic artistic collaboration. But just look at how Hanyu tried to douse the fire of gossip pre-emptively with his comments in the P&G talk re how the tabloids seem to be reporting on a completely different Yuzuru Hanyu (which can be taken as a measure of the extent of gossip present such that he felt required to bring up the topic spontaneously without being asked and compelled to make the remarks he did). To be frank, I'm not entirely sure how effective that pre-emptive strike was, given that the tabloids could just sell it as him being coy - to tabloids, attention and interest, whether negative or positive, is their lifeline. The worst possible thing for tabloids would be for people to just be disinterested. A line of thought in psychology is that although love and hate are often described as being diametrically opposed, ie polar opposite, in reality, there's only a thin line between them - they both require a certain strength of emotion towards someone. Not caring, ignoring, that's like the true polar opposite - there is no emotion towards that someone. Hence the saying that the opposite of love is not hate, but indifference. In a similar way, the lifeline for tabloids are those who are pro/wishful/hopeful for some particular rumour to be true (let's aliken that to 'love') and those who are fiercely against that some rumour (let's aliken that to 'hate') generate interest - both have that strength of emotions towards something (not necessarily someone in this instance) that help drive the sales of tabloids. When people don't care, and they ignore the issue, there's no interest. No interest = no sales. And sales is the ultimate bottom line for tabloids. ...I should stop rambling on...

I didn't watch much of Worlds 2018 men's skating. Watching Chen's performance, my only impression was that it was like watching a rabbit jump all over the ice - don't get me wrong, the raw athleticism was great, but if I wanted to watch only raw athleticism, there are other sports I would watch instead that would satisfy that 'need'. I missed the sense of wonderment that artistry combined with athleticism can give, such as the feeling I get watching Fernandez, Hanyu, etc. If ice skating was only about jumps, they might as well just put hurdles at various points over the ice and call it ice-hurdling. Ice skating is as much about artistry as it is about the athleticism in my opinion. The real problem, in my books, is how artistry can be scored objectively, as it can be a very subjective area.

I love the initial reaction he expresses in that clip - that look of slight bewilderment and stunned confusion. Reminds me of the time the compere told the audience that Yuzuru would take (and reply to) questions in English first at a press conference.

I suspect Orser would have asked Hanyu. Remember, Fernandez was asked by Orser whether he'd be happy to have Hanyu at TCC as well all those years ago. Remember also, that Orser did ask Hanyu about having Medvedeva at TCC. So I would be surprised if Orser didn't at least mention Jin to Hanyu before it was all confirmed.

I have to be honest when I say that the amount of attention and knowledge that members of this forum have regarding this matter is a testament to the powers of observation as much as it is bordering on the disturbing...I wonder at Hanyu's reaction/thoughts to all of this if indeed it is true that he lurks on these forums... Again, the degree of certainty is slightly worrying. Should one ask further?

I recall reading somewhere that Yuzuru was long-sighted (he wears glasses when studying/reading). As such, he probably does see more easily people in those seats mentioned (more easily than most other performers anyway).

Note how he sprayed Kikuchi-san as well, not that Kikuchi-san needs much hair-styling He seems reasonably liberal with the spray!

"Darling it's better, down where it's wetter..."