LourdesMoon

Sorry! I think one comment just led to another on my part! Will move it over next time LOL

Here's the link if you're ever curious. They don't talk about Nathan here too much but more about Shoma and Vincent. A few seconds on Yuzu lol.

I hate to admit that is probably the case...but it's very frustrating as a long-time fan and viewer to know it's not ALL true. I understand the logic behind it though, even if I vehemently disagree and feel that it's not their honest opinions.

I'll have to disagree with you there. They are implying Nathan has the full package now, that his program components have improved (they have but not to the level of marks he is receiving) and that his strength lies in his GOE (which arguably is only because of the misuse of the new system), which is different then simply praising the two-time World Champion. But this Nathan narrative is problem for almost all commentators now, because it's what sells, so I can't blame them for going in that direction.

I don't think they should list every flaw, but I remember when Alina Zagitova did her LP at Cup of China last year before Olympics. Kurt mentioned her under-rotations and how ladies often cheat some of their jumps and that judging would be harsher on that going forward, yet they still had time to praise certain parts of the program for being smart and capitalizing on points strategically. I would love if they could do that more often for all disciplines. That's what I meant. But CBC is the commentators I turn to the most so I'm not saying they are the worst by any means. They are more balanced, but they could be even better is all I'm saying.

I don't have the transcript and don't really have the time to go watch the CBC recap and WTT commentary again, but this was the impression I got not only about how Kurt talked about Vincent but about Nathan as well. Even if he explicitly doesn't say something that negates these skaters' mistakes/ flaws, the hype and praise suggests the judging is fair, which we've established that it isn't. That's my only issue here.

I hope no thinks I have an issue with Kurt, I really do enjoy his commentary, but as a commentator shouldn't he mention these things? Even simply saying the issue hasn't gone away but that the audience should be aware that judges make calls based on various factors (camera angles, emotion, etc) would still be beneficial rather than simply staying quiet and being ok with the calls, wouldn't it?

I think I used the wrong terminology in my comment. I mean that his comment here and in the WTT 2019 commentary suggest that Vincent's programs are without flaws now and that his jumps are no longer under-rotated. I shouldn't have simply said support, sorry. Of course he can support him.

I love Browning as much as the next person but despite his knowledge on FS and jumps...he has been making some questionable statements regarding the men don't you think? Or is it just me?

But his support of Vincent (and his praise of his programs/jumps) implies Vincent hasn't under-rotated lately...but he has. So despite his expertise...why is he saying this?

I think he said that as way to say he doesn't under-rotate and that it's his ankles creating that illusion. That's how I interpreted that statement...because it's like...impossible for someone to under-rotate a waltz jump???

I mean the method of taking audience questions was kinda dumb to begin with? Why call it a season recap if they don't actually do the recap on the the 4 disciplines first THEN take audience questions...that would be more fair for everyone. I wouldn't have minded if they took time to do that.

I agree with you. I'll also add, that almost every time he's lost to Nathan it has been because of a Quad Salchow. Those things really ruin his groove. In 4CC 2017, he popped the Quad Salchow combo in the short and long (but did his Yolo comeback in the LP), at RoC 2017 it was the Quad Loop that he popped in the Short I believe, but the Quad Salchow still gave him some trouble in the Long (he didn't complete the combo - which might've made a difference) AND at WC 2017 the Quad Salchow in the Short and Long program were the things which brought his mark down. SOOOO...can we do some voodoo for the Salchow to behave or...???

I don't know if I'd go that far because Kurt has a tendency to say things that can be taken out of context. I remember when he reacted to the idea that Yuzu hadn't won two GPs in a row as something super shocking and that he thought he should've won more. He also said that "he's [Yuzu] had more luck at Olympics than Worlds" which implies that it only took luck...I don't think he means any of it. It's just how he speaks. I remember he got a lot of backlash for the first comment about Yuzu's lack of medals and people sent a lot of tweets his way to the point where he had to address it by saying he didn't mean it in that manner and that he loves Yuzu a great deal. BUT...he does get on the Quad hype train A LOT. He has blatantly ignored problems that Shoma, Nathan, and now Vincent have showcased with their quads in the past. Shoma is one he ignores because his style is just very appealing and it's gotten ignored by the judges so I suppose to not confuse viewership, they don't say anything unless the marks suggest that they should say something. Nathan has gotten a major pass because he has been dubbed the "Quad King" in North America (first) and Kurt has a connection with American skaters due to his past in Professional Skating and Stars on Ice. He appreciates Nathan's athleticism and as I've said before, probably felt for Nathan when he had the Olympic mishap in the Short program reminiscent of his own. It's fine to love Nathan's skating...no problem there, but he's said that he has the complete package, deserves his marks, and used very similar praises about Yuzu for Nathan in the WTT 2019 commentary. For example suggesting that Nathan's strengths lie in his GOE (???), which it never did because GOE used to rely more on transitions, landing positions, and integration in the program which we don't see from Nathan. Now that GOE's first main bullets rely on height, distance and good jump position, Nathan's GOE can't really be questioned as much as it once was. Anyway...the reason Vincent gets a pass, as we've learned in the live season recap is that Kurt has been working with him. The personal bias shouldn't influence how he disregards Vincent's under-rotations but he DOES??? I've said before that I'm Canadian, and I love Kurt. But his misinformation right now is ruining how audiences view the men's discipline. It isn't as well-balanced as he says it is...by buying into the narrative that Nathan is now the "chosen one," Kurt is allowing people to continue to believe the grading is fair. I really don't know what to say to that because I had high hopes that this recap would at least just be fluff about everyone's efforts this year, but it gave me more reason to question CBC commentary (at least in the Men's discipline). Carol seems more fair and aware of how Ice Dance is going. Also...I predicted this before but looked like a pessimist...but using Yuzu's picture and then talking about him for 5 seconds was...kinda low?

The CBC live stream (with PJ, Carol, and Kurt) , for anyone who's curious, mentioned Yuzu's amazing presence on the ice and how he's magical (for maybe 5 to 10 secs) but didn't really say much else. The specific quote was in regards to how Kurt doesn't think athleticism is influencing the marks too much (LOL) because, "we have seen skaters come up who could quad, easily and beautifully, and they did not rise to the top, they were most often suppressed by someone like Yuzuru Hanyu who had a magic, who had a flair with the blade, who stood at centre ice and like... (Plushenko)... (paraphrased: could control the crowd)" etc. Note the use of past tense (had) which is most likely not intentional but as an English Major/Teacher it was hard for me not to say anything. So only watch if you want to hear some 20-something minutes of discourse about Shoma's arms during landings, Vincent NOT under-rotating (because Kurt gave him some helpful tips and because this season has improved his confidence), the French Ice Dance team having very subjective scoring (although deserved), and just some general fluff about hard-working skaters. EDIT: That photo promo really feels like a let down now.