General Skating Chat

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11 時間前, kaerythさんが言いました:

Miki is answering questions re:FS in a Japanese newspaper? I think here she's explaining Yuzu's scoresheet... (did it have to be Worlds'17 SP ??). Anyway, it's always nice to see how prominent FS is in Japan.

 

 

 

6 時間前, OonsieHuiさんが言いました:

Should have used the beautiful ACI 17 SP protocol. That was a thing of beauty and so satisfying to look at. 

 

 

Hmm...as this is for the purpose of education, I think they needed a protocol that shows both negative and positive GOEs, and with Hanyu both being a household name in Japan and that protocol having both a maximum deduction and some pretty impressive positives, it serves the purpose perfectly.

 

6 時間前, OonsieHuiさんが言いました:

This might sound really stupid, but how is it that competing in Olympics, World's etc doesn't make your profession 'figure skater' ? How are they 'amateurs' who 'go pro' when they retire? That's always confused me....   

 

 

5 時間前, kaerythさんが言いました:

 

This is a bit tricky... a professional figure skater is a skater by profession - meaning they get paid to skate or being a figure skater is their job. Amateur or competitive skaters aren't paid to skate/compete. They win prize money or get sponsorships.  Sometime competitive skaters do ice shows but it is strictly regulated by ISU and their federation. Plushenko was once banned from competition for 1 year because he did ice shows without pre approval from his federation.

 

 

Expounding on what @xeyra has said, from what I'm able to tell professional athletes and skaters are paid to do what they do. They don't necessarily have to win per se (which is why you get things like match fixing, which is illegal but it happens). When you're competing, you get sponsored to compete and preferably to win but you don't actually get paid directly for competing, winning or losing, which makes you an amateur. The concept of professional athletes only work for things like team sports, wrestling, boxing (and all other variations of ring sports), racing, etc. where the leagues and/or matches/competitions itself are organized by big corporations and the prizes are all given by them.

 

Skaters are only considered professional when they're paid to show up to specifically skate, but they're no longer really considered as athletes. Which was why skaters who were still actively competing didn't use to be able to appear on ice shows. Necessity and practicality have since made them possible to switch between the two statuses, though, which is why we all get to see active competitors on show ice presently.

[SparkleSalad]

Does this spin position have a name (the one after the layback with straight up and down arms)?

Who was the first to do it? I just associate it with Adam because he does it so beautifully but I've noticed a lot of people doing it this season.

 

delightfully gay source

[Xen]

1 minute ago, SparkleSalad said:

Does this spin position have a name (the one after the layback with straight up and down arms)?

Who was the first to do it? I just associate it with Adam because he does it so beautifully but I've noticed a lot of people doing it this season.

 

delightfully gay source

Might be a side layback? I need to check....

[singcarcom]

On 10/9/2017 at 10:06 AM, xeyra said:

As promised, here's an update on the speculative layout table I posted back in page 33, with more current info.

 

Blue - Confirmed layouts OR layouts tried in competition this season (more or less)

Purple - Possible endgame layouts

Non-colored - Different options or mere possibilities, when uncertain

 

  Hide contents

In Nathan's case I can't predict what he'll do in each competition, so I'm sticking with the 7-quad option in the predictions. In Shoma's case, I also can't really predict what he'll do either so I'm going for more than one possibility. Will Boyang upgrade his FS layout? Will Javier add a 4Lo? Stay tuned, this season is going to be a headache and a half!

 

These may change as the season progresses, of course, because the Men are crazy. 

 

SKATER	SP BV	LAYOUT	FS BV	LAYOUT	TOTAL BV	NOTES
HANYU	51.01 49.51 52.61	4Lo // 3A 4T3T 4S // 3A 4T3T 4Lz // 3A 4T3T	111.26	4Lz 4Lo 3F // 4S3T 4T1Lo3S 4T 3A2T 3A	162.27 160.77 163.87	SP layout a question mark but likely to use 4Lo
CHEN	55.32	3A // 4F3T 4Lz	123.86 124.16	4Lo 4Lz 4F3T // 4Lz2T 4F 4T2T2Lo 4S 3A 4Lo 4Lz 4F2T // 4Lz3T 4F 4T2T2Lo 4S 3A	179.18 179.48	currently using triples in his layouts endgame: 7 quads?
UNO	51.31	4F // 4T3T 3A	109.59 111.79 112.69 119.63	4Lo 4S 3A3T // 4F 4T2T 4T 3A1Lo3F 3S 4Lo 4S 3A3T // 4F 4F2T 4T 3A1Lo3F 3S 4Lo 4Lz 3A3T // 4F 4T2T 4T 3A1Lo3F 3S 4Lo 4Lz 4S // 4F 4T2T 4T 3A1Lo3F 3A3T	160.90 163.10 164.00 170.94	may yet introduce 4Lz or add second 4F or maybe change SP layout (add 4Lo?)
JIN	51.33	4Lz3T 3A // 4T	103.70 110.78	4Lz 4S 3A1Lo3S // 4T2T 4T 3A 3Lz3T 3F 4Lz3T 4S 4Lo // 4T 4T2T 3A1Lo3S 3A 3Lz	155.03 162.11	same layout as last season or add 4Lo? (4CC layout)
FERNANDEZ	47.75	4T3T 4S // 3A	95.13 99.61 102.55	4T 4S3T 3A2T // 4S 3Lo 3A 3Lz 3F1Lo3S   4Lo 4S3T 3A3T // 4T 3Lo 3A 3Lz 3F1Lo3S 4Lo 4S3T 3A2T // 4S 4T 3A 3Lz 3F1Lo3S	142.88 147.36 150.30	same layout as last season or add 4Lo?
CHAN	48.05	4T3T 4S // 3A	94.25	4T3T 4S 3A1Lo3S // 4T 3A 3Lo2T 3Lz 3F	142.30	same FS layout but with 2 quad SP
ZHOU	53.15	4Lz 4F3T // 3A	106.01 112.29 117.90	4Lz 4F 4S // 4T 3Lz3T 3A 3A2T 3Lz1Lo3F 4Lz 4F 4S3T // 4T 4S 3A 3A2T 3Lz1Lo3F 4Lz 4F 4S3T // 4Lz2T 4T 4S 3A 3Lz1Lo3F	159.16 165.44 171.05	using variations of 4-5 quads layouts. endgame: 6 quads?
KOLYADA	51.15	4Lz 4T3T // 3A	94.38	4Lz 4S 3A2T // 4T 3A 3Lz1Lo3S 3Lo 3Lz	145.53

 

 

With so much concern about high BVs from younger skaters, I forgot that Yuzu kinda catched up to them in this game...can't believe he has the 2nd highest BV as of now. XD

Nathan's potential layout looks really scary....When I saw Nathan's recent FS, I was really impressed with his choreo and step sequence. But when he enters the jumping sequences, the magic disappears and I lament that we can't see those beautiful skating from Nathan when he is jumping.

 

On 10/10/2017 at 6:02 PM, beki said:

Even if someone beats H&L's score, they can't overcome its impact. Because it was pretty much perfect. I just don't expect that level of poetry in motion from anyone else, even if they land insane quads. The spins, steps and GOE aren't there for them.

Yea...I think others will only beat H&L's score due to much higher BVs and decent execution. No one other than Yuzu has beaten Seimei's record even now.

I would prefer not to see anyone but Yuzu break WRs, but no matter who does what, no one can replace Yuzu's status in Figure Skating.

 

On 10/10/2017 at 6:18 PM, SSS said:

BTW, I found out Yuzu is the only one who didn't get gold in first competition among top 6 except Patrick who hasn't started ??? Blame  Brian is trying hard for Canadian silver...

Karma for reinforcing the Olympic Silver curse on Canadian men? 

[PomeloPooh]

4 hours ago, Sammie said:

I just saw Vincent 4lz with a ribbon. Very nice indeed. Why do everyone go for the 4lz though? Nobody really doing the 4lo ..... 

 

I remember in the TV interview after WTT they said that the difficulty of jumps to each individual is different, thus why Boyang learnt 4Lz before 4Lo and Shoma 4F before 4S etc. From what I read generally I get the impression that edge jumps esp. quads requires really great control, which could make them more difficult for many people than 4Lz, a toe jump. Also, I guess when you only have time to try to stabilize one quad, going for Lutz is really economical, since even if you fall, as long as you rotate, you get as much as a shakily landed 4T. 

[SSS]

3 hours ago, singcarcom said:

Yea...I think others will only beat H&L's score due to much higher BVs and decent execution. No one other than Yuzu has beaten Seimei's record even now.

I would prefer not to see anyone but Yuzu break WRs, but no matter who does what, no one can replace Yuzu's status in Figure Skating.

I just watched H&L again. it is like magic..can't believe I watched it live online...

Nobody will beat it currently. H&L is perfect. I don't think anyone but Yuzu will surpass H&L's performance now, even with higher BV and the funny H&L score...I don't see hopes in uncle team and boys at least need several years with correct technique.

going to watch H&L again.

[xeyra]

7 hours ago, Sammie said:

I just saw Vincent 4lz with a ribbon. Very nice indeed. Why do everyone go for the 4lz though? Nobody really doing the 4lo ..... 

 

Is this video recent? I remember seeing a rippon 4Lz from Vincent back after he won Jr. Worlds, so I don't know if it's the same video or if it's a new one. What I remember thinking back then was that though I love rippons and doing one with a 4Lz is super impressive, I found the rippon really awkward in a quad jump, probably because it has more rotations? 

[SparkleSalad]

38 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

Is this video recent? I remember seeing a rippon 4Lz from Vincent back after he won Jr. Worlds, so I don't know if it's the same video or if it's a new one. What I remember thinking back then was that though I love rippons and doing one with a 4Lz is super impressive, I found the rippon really awkward in a quad jump, probably because it has more rotations? 

 

 

This? I think it looks amazing, like a wind-up toy or something. Going into it looks a bit funny but after that 

[xeyra]

1 minute ago, SparkleSalad said:

 

 

This? I think it looks amazing, like a wind-up toy or something. Going into it looks a bit funny but after that 

 

I think this is actually a different video than the one I remember seeing. The angle and I think the fact he's tightened the arms more for the rippon from the version I saw makes it look better already.

[Xen]

Just now, xeyra said:

 

I think this is actually a different video than the one I remember seeing. The angle and I think the fact he's tightened the arms more for the rippon from the version I saw makes it look better already.

Why do I feel like Yuzu probably has instagram, twitter etc, just to follow other skater's video posts? And now after seeing this, do you think he'd be tempted to Rippon one of his quads?

[Sombreuil]

I think it looks fine - as long as it's used as an accent and not plastered onto every jumping pass.  For me that ends up looking a bit ridiculous but that's a personal preference.

 

[SparkleSalad]

9 minutes ago, Xen said:

Why do I feel like Yuzu probably has instagram, twitter etc, just to follow other skater's video posts? And now after seeing this, do you think he'd be tempted to Rippon one of his quads?

 

I need it. Gimmegimmegimme. (Would suit sharpness of SEIMEI, just sayin'. >_>)

[xeyra]

11 minutes ago, Xen said:

Why do I feel like Yuzu probably has instagram, twitter etc, just to follow other skater's video posts? And now after seeing this, do you think he'd be tempted to Rippon one of his quads?

 

No. 

As in, please no. I like his quads as they are, tyvm. 

[xeyra]

 

Here's another angle of the rippon 4Lz. And I guess Vincent might go for two 4Lz in his FS, which I thought he might do in my layout table, though I think I need to add one layout where his lutz combo comes at the beginning. 

[Xen]

8 minutes ago, xeyra said:

 

No. 

As in, please no. I like his quads as they are, tyvm. 

I'm joking okay. Besides, Yuzu already rippons his combo jump, his aesthetics probably won't permit him to permiate his layout with rippons.

 

Just now, xeyra said:

 

Here's another angle of the rippon 4Lz. And I guess Vincent might go for two 4Lz in his FS, which I thought he might do in my layout table, though I think I need to add one layout where his lutz combo comes at the beginning. 

This 4Lz obsession with men this season....