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2019–20 Coronavirus Pandemic (COVID-19) Thread


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It’s normal annual flu vaccine style thinking, not pandemic thinking.  I have a friend who works for PHE and they were lucky to have enough (persuasive) flexible thinkers who were willing to treat the pandemic as a totally new situation and problem solve from scratch rather than try and use an existing system to get as many vaccines into as many people as quickly as possible.  It’s no good sitting in a vial in the fridge for an extra week.

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1 hour ago, river said:

 

Holding doses to ensure an adequate supply? Why? Vaccines don't actually help unless they're in someone's arm... not doing much good sitting in a freezer.

Plus, they're trying to shift the blame from the provincial health ministry onto local public health units. And yesterday they tried to shift the blame to the federal government for not ordering enough, so the feds immediately published their numbers - how much vaccine has been shipped to provinces vs how much of it has been shot into arms already. The province comes out looking poorly there too. 

 

And they're going so slow! 

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12 minutes ago, Sombreuil said:

It’s normal annual flu vaccine style thinking, not pandemic thinking.

This is exactly the problem. I don't think any of the people involved in decision-making have yet clued in - a year in! - that this COVID's not like other diseases and that fighting it calls for an all-out assault engaging every resource. They seem to think they can mosey their way through this at half-speed. 

 

It's not for nothing I'm comparing this situation to a forest fire. Everyone knows forest fires don't wait for you to put a perfect plan in place to fight them, you just have to go all-in and flat out from the start until it's done. 

 

They keep saying 'trust the science', but they're making the mistake of letting the scientists set the pace. I know what kind of people work in health care bureaucracy here - and they're plodders. They neither like nor understand acting fast. 

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3 hours ago, rockstaryuzu said:

The latest news in my province.

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/ontario-government-confirms-covid-19-vaccines-being-held-back-to-guarantee-supply-1.5357475

 

Holy Hannah. 

 

COVID-19 is a raging forest fire at this point. We're in a forest fire. And the guy in charge of the fire hoses won't issue the pumps because he's worried about draining the water supply. 

 

That's how stupid this is. 

 

 

"Stupid" is too kind to describe this.

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Old fashioned appointments systems just won’t cope in this.  I had an email with a number to ring and was given the choice of two centres quite close to me with appointments 36-48 hours later.  I’ll get my follow up appointment the same way next month.  Staffed by volunteers- ordinary people doing the marshalling, making sure people keep the 2m distance, wear masks properly and wait the 15 mins after to ensure no anaphylactic reaction, and all sorts of needle qualified volunteers to do the jabs - phlebotomists, paramedics, student drs and nurses, midwives, etc all volunteering a few hours.

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1 hour ago, rockstaryuzu said:

They keep saying 'trust the science', but they're making the mistake of letting the scientists set the pace. I know what kind of people work in health care bureaucracy here - and they're plodders. They neither like nor understand acting fast. 

It is the politicians not scientists that are the problem. Trying to look good and appeal to everyone in a controversial situation like this does not work. Governments need to be firm and implement a strict vaccination plan or it is useless.

Real scientists have been pleading to have everyone vaccinated as soon as possible to stop the virus from further mutation, which could be even more deadly. But no one listens to them.

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1 hour ago, Neenah said:

It is the politicians not scientists that are the problem. Trying to look good and appeal to everyone in a controversial situation like this does not work. Governments need to be firm and implement a strict vaccination plan or it is useless.

Real scientists have been pleading to have everyone vaccinated as soon as possible to stop the virus from further mutation, which could be even more deadly. But no one listens to them.

Our politicians have been taking their cues from our public health docs - none of whom are willing to call for the kind of forceful effort required to speed up our vaccination process.  We shouldn't be piddling around with getting people to book appointments - just first come, first served, everyone get through the door as fast as possible. We're not doing that. 

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Usually the flu vaccine here is done by GPs and practice nurses.  For Covid they are covering the nursing homes and elderly people who can’t get to the centres, so our care home resident has had both of his jabs at the home, and our 90 year old had a house visit from the GP. The rest of us are being called as our age group/ at risk group comes up on the NHS systems in our area.  A very great many mistakes were made at the beginning but this seems to be going well.  When vaccines are near their use by they are offering them to anyone in the next group who will take it up.

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7 hours ago, Sombreuil said:

When vaccines are near their use by they are offering them to anyone in the next group who will take it up.

If Ontario added even this part to their vaccination strategy it would speed things up considerably.  They have thousand of appointment times going unused (probably because most of demographic groups they've prioritized til now are not big computer users and find online booking difficult,  and the phone lines are too busy to get through), and those should be filled with whoever is next on the waiting list. 

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I read in an article earlier today that Canada is one of the few countries where all 3 of the major variants (UK, SAfrican, Brazilian) are becoming significant at the same time. The article made it sound like the world will be very interested in this as we'll be a testing ground to see which of the "Big 3," as i"ll call them, becomes dominant among them. And, we're so happy to provide this.  It will also be possible to get some better data on how well the vaccines stack up against the variants since they haven't got much data out of Brazil etc.. and we can find out how many people can get reinfected as well.... :furious:

 

Those damn clinics for not working around the clock to vaccinate... or the govt for holding back doses for later... or some countries with production facilities not sharing as much as they could (but they had to clean up the fire in their own backyard first)... and many more damnations can be added to this list...

 

i"m glad for the lock down in Ontario, but as usual, they left it too late to try to appease everyone and ended up making no one happy....

 

I"m just glad my parents finally got vaccinated this week too. And I'm grateful to be tested daily, even though that sounds rough. At least I know I'm ok, even if I"m not going anywhere these days.

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