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[2020] 4CC (04-09.02) - Men Short Program

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Just now, Crow said:


You forget to mention what a great help Yuzu was to help clear up faster :xD:

Yes, 20 girls + 1 Yuzu :D

(btw they sent everyone on the ice, even ice resurfacing girls, LMAO)

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Gandy-san about Zuzu (google translate)

Quote

Hanyu


pitch perfect
Sounds perfect

It took a lot of time to score
According to local information, it was said that I saw it many times with slow, but I think that there was nothing suspicious
Won't you decide not to pass through water?

TR is all judges 9.50?

GOE and PCS are too low

I guess at the judge meeting, "I'm not going to give Hanyu a GOE of +5 and a PCS of 10.00."
If so, GOE ignores the rule of +5 with 5 items plus


He said he wanted 112, but he was humble. Is it because I got 112 in the old grade?
I expected +3.67 points higher in total

Breakdown is that GOE can only think of +5 for elements other than camel spin

Every jump jumps right from the step and the landing is perfect and the height, width and flow are great. All the jumps were based on the old rules with the GOE score (ex: GPS2015 for 4S, GPF2015 for 4T + 3T, Pyeongchang Olympics for 3A)?

Spins, especially for CSSp, only have a high rotation speed, but it is impossible to get up to +4 for this spin, which can easily handle +5 and satisfy all items. A spin that won the GOE perfect score (eg 2017 Autumn) with the old rules?

What is almost a +4 step? Was the GOE perfect score (eg Pyeongchang Olympics) according to the old rules?


Isn't the GOE clearer after the successful jumps? ? ?
Someone can get a perfect score even if he makes a mistake ...?

Remember why we expanded the scope of the GOE to the public? ? ? ? ?
I still remember

PCS is clearly better than GPF2015 which was the highest PCS in this jump configuration, so I want all items +0.25 from the protocol at that time. So the TR is 9.86 and the other four are 10.00

Isn't Hanyu good at Hanyu ratio? (Angry)

It is too low according to the rules and Hanyu ratio

Even if you lower the score, the performance will not change
What will change is your feelings for the judges and the ISU


I think it was the best SP ever

http://gandy.seesaa.net/article/473484338.html

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4 hours ago, MatchaBeans said:

B: ???

Y: I guess???

(All three laugh)

 

1 hour ago, LadySnowblood said:

B: You broke the computer.

Y: Again!

 

Oh I listened to this and Brian clearly (to me) says "Wow...lots of pooh bears." And Yuzu says "Again!"

 

:laughing: funny how we can all hear completely different things.

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2 hours ago, Henni147 said:

Someone has calculated the waiting time between the end of the skate and the announcement of the scores for all international events where Yuzu competed in. Very... uhm... insightful...

 

At first glance you might say, they just needed so long to clear up all the Poohs, but... that still doesn't explain, why they needed 3 minutes for some of Yuzu's programs and 6 minutes for another.

Plus: at ACI there was no Pooh rain at all as far as I remember. And yet the judges needed 5:28 minutes to score his FS.

 

 

Wow so SC didn't have as many Poohs as ACI so much less waiting time? :darklordyuzu:

(I'll never buy the clearing Pooh time theory cuz as we see, SC just got Pooh rain like any comp yet the waiting time is quite normal, NHK was MASSIVE Pooh rain but just 3-4min waiting too)

 

SC is also the only comp he got "normal" waiting time and the score was also the closest to what he did on ice. So we know how the extra time up to 5-6min in other comps is used lol.

 

Unrelated to waiting time but Yuzu mentioned P/C in EC =>  an evidence he watches ALL disciplines and def understand the sport's condition better than any fan. He surely knows all the things that are happening and still tries his best to stay in this sport, that's respectable.

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Re: the wait time.

 

I've always chalked it up to fudges going

 

"Wait, he didn't jump any of the BIG jumps, but we're giving him that score??!!! Hold up! Let's check again. Did I really gave +5 for that 3A? I mean, it ticks all the boxes, but it's just? a? triple? Better change that to +4. And,,, ok, again +5 for 4S? but that's... just... a Salchow??, pfffft, changing that to +4. Let's see. Tech panellist, are you sure those are all level 4s for everything else? Are yOU SURE????!!! Ugh, Ok I guess. Now, PCS, what can I deduct... Hmm... Well, huh. Ugh, maybe TR? cz you know, it's nothing like any from the Almighty Eteri camp. Yep, deduct that one... Never mind all the TR actually enhances music. Lalalalala... Well, and ugh, why not SS too, cz... bananas. Ok, phew. That was quick right? And very subtle? Yep *nods*"

 

in their fudging, and questionable TP combing through every. single. thing. Yuzu did, cz they too can't believe what the fudges gave this no-4F/4Lz program.

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2 minutes ago, yuzupon said:

Re: the wait time.

 

I've always chalked it up to fudges going

 

"Wait, he didn't jump any of the BIG jumps, but we're giving him that score??!!! Hold up! Let's check again. Did I really gave +5 for that 3A? I mean, it ticks all the boxes, but it's just? a? triple? Better change that to +4. And,,, ok, again +5 for 4S? but that's... just... a Salchow??, pfffft, changing that to +4. Let's see. Tech panellist, are you sure those are all level 4s for everything else? Are yOU SURE????!!! Ugh, Ok I guess. Now, PCS, what can I deduct... Hmm... Well, huh. Ugh, maybe TR? cz you know, it's nothing like any from the Almighty Eteri camp. Yep, deduct that one... Never mind all the TR actually enhances music. Lalalalala... Well, and ugh, why not SS too, cz... bananas. Ok, phew. That was quick right? And very subtle? Yep *nods*"

 

in their fudging, and questionable TP combing through every. single. thing. Yuzu did, cz they too can't believe what the fudges gave this no-4F/4Lz program.

 

"Gaaaah. Why is this annoying Hanyu guy still here and why does he skate so well?! This is unfaaaaaaair... He brings our judges into trouble at every single competition and makes our poster boy look bad." :gaah:

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That’s a bit harsh - not ‘bad’ - just pedestrian.....

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2 hours ago, Henni147 said:

Someone has calculated the waiting time between the end of the skate and the announcement of the scores for all international events where Yuzu competed in. Very... uhm... insightful...

 

At first glance you might say, they just needed so long to clear up all the Poohs, but... that still doesn't explain, why they needed 3 minutes for some of Yuzu's programs and 6 minutes for another.

Plus: at ACI there was no Pooh rain at all as far as I remember. And yet the judges needed 5:28 minutes to score his FS.

 

 

 

....you know how sometimes (if not often) you'd just have to assume no ill intent from other people when they mess things up for you, well... I try my darndest to assume no ill intent towards those jUDgEs, but they made it increasingly hard if not nigh impossible  for me to do so.... 😑😑😒😒

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Maybe the TP enjoyed Yuzu's performance so much that they watched it again in slow mo and that is what caused the long wait   :biggrin:

 

Joking aside, I think that the delay is caused by the TP. If it was the judges trying to manipulate the scores they wouldn't have gone up from what we saw after the performance. My theory is that the judges are being told not to give full marks for some reason and of course that (like the PC cap) only applies to Yuzu and P/C.  As to why the TP are so determined to find faults in his skating, I have no idea.

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3 hours ago, sweetwater said:

I don't know... to me, it sounds more like "They don't worry me" or "They don't rewarding me" or something. I hear faint i or ee between wa (or wo) and "me."

 

ETA: I hope you guys don't jump to a conclusion hearing this kind of not-so-clear conversation. Even when you can hear him clearly, his words can be interpreted in many ways, especially when he is speaking broken English...

I can't really imagine him saying "They don't worry me" because 1. he looks clearly worried, and 2. both of his coaches look a bit uncomfortable at whatever it is that he says, Brian even gives him a little side-eye, like "I wish you wouldn't say that in public" and Ghislain is all "did y'all hear anything? I didn't hear anything!" And they wouldn't react like that. Also the expression he has, I think is the one he gets when he makes negative statements about himself. That self-deprecating laugh. But I will admit I can't be sure what exactly he says. It sounds like "They don't want (... too quiet to hear...)". I can believe "They don't want to give" or so, especially as he then mentions P/C and the Euros thing, more as a 'see, it happened recently, someone was kept waiting a long time and they got silver'. Or maybe he was alluding to what Guillaume said, about how the judges were told not to give so many 10s, silently suggesting it might be the case here, too.

 

It's true Yuzu doesn't usually speak about these things, but he has started to more openly acknowledge the issue. The "I hope the rotation is ok for the toe" was said in the disguise of a cutsey joke, but that was an obvious and not at all discreet jab at the bogus calls at ACI. Which he also pretty much called that, though in far more polite and discreet words. He's openly said there are scoring issues, without outright complaining. Although he'd be entitled to. And even just bringing up P/C, which was somewhat controversial, is a sign he's not being that careful and quiet anymore. I doubt he's not aware the KnC conversations are taped. So if he says things like that, it's because he wants to say them. So I wouldn't be entirely surprised if he did say something that direct. Not anymore. He's been very open this season in general, so he might be opening up about that, too.

 

All that said, I agree it's hard to figure out EXACTLY what he said. So we probably shouldn't take any possibility as fact.

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9 minutes ago, KatjaThera said:

I can't really imagine him saying "They don't worry me" because 1. he looks clearly worried, and 2. both of his coaches look a bit uncomfortable at whatever it is that he says, Brian even gives him a little side-eye, like "I wish you wouldn't say that in public" and Ghislain is all "did y'all hear anything? I didn't hear anything!" And they wouldn't react like that. Also the expression he has, I think is the one he gets when he makes negative statements about himself. That self-deprecating laugh. But I will admit I can't be sure what exactly he says. It sounds like "They don't want (... too quiet to hear...)". I can believe "They don't want to give" or so, especially as he then mentions P/C and the Euros thing, more as a 'see, it happened recently, someone was kept waiting a long time and they got silver'. Or maybe he was alluding to what Guillaume said, about how the judges were told not to give so many 10s, silently suggesting it might be the case here, too.

 

It's true Yuzu doesn't usually speak about these things, but he has started to more openly acknowledge the issue. The "I hope the rotation is ok for the toe" was said in the disguise of a cutsey joke, but that was an obvious and not at all discreet jab at the bogus calls at ACI. Which he also pretty much called that, though in far more polite and discreet words. He's openly said there are scoring issues, without outright complaining. Although he'd be entitled to. And even just bringing up P/C, which was somewhat controversial, is a sign he's not being that careful and quiet anymore. I doubt he's not aware the KnC conversations are taped. So if he says things like that, it's because he wants to say them. So I wouldn't be entirely surprised if he did say something that direct. Not anymore. He's been very open this season in general, so he might be opening up about that, too.

 

All that said, I agree it's hard to figure out EXACTLY what he said. So we probably shouldn't take any possibility as fact.

IA, I don't think "They don't worry me" would be immediately followed by him talking about a case study of Cizeron/Papadakis as something that's worrisome (clearly) to him ... funny how Brian doesn't seem to have like any idea what Yuzu's talking about lol (not a true skating fan!). And once again I'm surprised at how much Yuzu studies the sport down to the last detail. It goes to show he's as much  aware about the corruption in the ISU if not leaps and bounds more than the rest of us fans are. 

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32 minutes ago, Neenah said:

My theory is that the judges are being told not to give full marks for some reason and of course that (like the PC cap) only applies to Yuzu and P/C.

Look what PCS P/C were gettig until euros. When last time Yuzuru was scored like that? Boston SP?

 

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1920/gpf1920/FSKXICEDANCE----------FNL-000100--_JudgesDetailsperSkater.pdf

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1819/wc2019/data0405.pdf

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1819/wc2019/data0403.pdf

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1718/wc2018/wc2018_IceDa

 

They got FORTY SIX 10s in total at WC 19. I'm honestly not surprised that someone told judges to calm down.

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22 minutes ago, yuzuangel said:

IA, I don't think "They don't worry me" would be immediately followed by him talking about a case study of Cizeron/Papadakis as something that's worrisome (clearly) to him ... funny how Brian doesn't seem to have like any idea what Yuzu's talking about lol (not a true skating fan!). And once again I'm surprised at how much Yuzu studies the sport down to the last detail. It goes to show he's as much  aware about the corruption in the ISU if not leaps and bounds more than the rest of us fans are. 

For Brian's defense - he was doing his coaching job at Euros, so he was not able to watch everything :) 

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5 hours ago, glilikoi said:

I feel like the sound quality is too unclear to say for sure if this is what he says. It sounds like a really strong statement from someone who usually avoids any direct criticism and is speaking in a semi-public space. So I kind of feel like it's more likely that Yuzu said something else that sounds a bit similar. It's clear that he's feeling nervous about the scores, and I don't doubt he worries about politicking privately. But this would be an unusually strong statement from him, so I'd like to hear a clearer recording before concluding that's what he says.

 

I think that's what he said but not quite what he meant. There's a word or phrase missing or implied (as in "they don't want me [to...]. (there's something in the intonation and spacing that makes it feel like an incomplete sentence to me, though of course this gets a bit muddled by English being a second language for Yuzu). I'm not sure it's deliberate or if it's because his English can't convey what he'd say in Japanese or if he's translating directly and the Japanese sentence he's using as his base has an implied meaning that the English does not. If he'd said "they don't want me to" and left it at that, as English speakers we'd get that he's not trying to say that they want him out but more like they don't want him to get a WR or a SB or to get a higher score than Nathan's GPF SP score or some other achievement. 

 

One thing is clear, regardless of what he said and meant there - the politicking and inflation and inconsistent scoring is getting him down, and he's probably even more nervous about it now after seeing what happened to P/C because a couple of months ago they were still the golden kids of ice dance and seemed like they were safe from the bs. Graz was a dramatic turn around and it made everything seem a lot more bleak. 

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53 minutes ago, Neenah said:

Joking aside, I think that the delay is caused by the TP. If it was the judges trying to manipulate the scores they wouldn't have gone up from what we saw after the performance. My theory is that the judges are being told not to give full marks for some reason and of course that (like the PC cap) only applies to Yuzu and P/C.  As to why the TP are so determined to find faults in his skating, I have no idea.

Exactly, as Romain Haguenauer said - who will get hurt by that? those who can possibly get 10s. IMO (although I know that many of you will dissagee ) P/C deserve those 10s if many other teams get around 9.5 PCS. I would give them 11. The same with Yuzu - if others get 9s, he deserves at least those 10s when he skates like yesterday (altough even 12 would not make a justice). So if there's a message for judges - not to throw 10s, the skaters, who already hit the PCS roof are hurt even more, because you can't push them any further, while you can do that with others. E.g. you see skater improved, and he/she/they was getting 8.5 last season, you go for 9. But then you see skaters like Yuzu or P/C  (who are high 9 or even 10) not skating his/their super very best (you saw them doing better before) - you also give 9. Does it mean they are on the same PCS level? Not exactly. The roof hurts the very best. Frozing the roof hurts them even more.

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